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3G experiment

Wandering speeds are a feature of mobile broadband.

To put it in context, ADSL and VDSL have a ceiling of performance. That ceiling depends on line length and line quality. The average "ceiling" in the village for ADSL is about 2.5Meg downstream so the connection will never go faster than that. For VDSL the "ceiling" would be say 76 Meg next to the cabinet, maybe 35Meg where you are, and 12Meg where I am assuming perfect copper line quality.

The ceiling for HSPA is 42Meg. Someone somewhere might have seen something like that once but most people will never get anywhere near that - 21Meg is outstanding.

My technical knowledge isn't detailed enough to know that if, for example, both you and I run a speed test at the same time, we'd each *definitely* see slower results as we're sharing the same bandwidth. It is true to say that the more people are using it (e.g. as people seek some form of broadband solution faster than ADSL) the more it slows down.

The biggest peril and most stupid thing a mobile operator could do, is offer "unlimited" usage. There is not unlimited capacity. EE's 4G is much more consistent but then it's more expensive and doesn't have an unlimited option. That said, I took the dongle back to the shop on Saturday for diagnosis since EE are telling me there are no transmitter faults and so we're using Three at the moment too.

To run reliable speed tests you'd need to make sure nothing else is using the connection at the same time and always select the same Speedtest.net server as those are themselves variable and 3G's latency is variable so if you let it auto-select it could pick anywhere from Germany to Newbury on the basis of a few ping tests at the start. (Latency is better on 4G than it is on 3G)

A "background speed test" program is of no value in this respect. If there's 20 Meg available and the TV is streaming a HD video from YouTube that will use up 5Meg anyway so the result will be 5Meg lower than it "ought to be". The results cannot be reliable.

A dongle connected to the PC with Outlook shut and the internal network disabled is the most reliable test.

This problem can only be solved by fibre-to-the-premises, or, by a wireless network provisioned with enough capacity. For example a wireless transmitter and repeaters - one per every ten homes - would see everyone able to get circa 30Meg even at peak times. Trouble is there's no "way forward" from that with current tech and when there is, that whole configuration might need to be changed. Only FTTP provides any kind of solution for everyone in even the medium term.

30 Meg for everyone would seem like a dream, though.

As I'm using Three I am seeing that weird phenomenon I never did resolve - that of wandering signals. If you watch the dongle status page - 5 bar HSPA, then 3 bar 3G then 1 bar 3G and back round again. It's like it's "hunting" among cells (there are three of them). And, our area shows outdoor coverage only for Three in most of this area. So the signal isn't as strong as it might be. That said - why, if it has 5 bars, it would elect to go to another cell with only 1 bar is a mystery to me. That started a year ago, and it's still doing it.

Variability is natural and built in and a factor of contention and signal strength, but from here, we cannot know precisely which one of those it is, or the extent to which each plays a part. For almost everyone in this area 3G is never slower than ADSL so it's about the best of a "bad bunch". 4G has more bandwidth on tap and the frequency set penetrates buildings much better, so although it doesn't solve these things, it ought to be - and is - more performant. Or it would be, if it worked at all - has been broken for three weeks. I shall await the news on the dongle, but something tells me it's going to be 'no fault found'.
 
Three back-to-back tests at 07:00, you wouldn't have thought it would be terribly contended at this hour.. upstream is fairly poor and downstream fairly normal.

Bournemouth server:

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Ealing server:

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I'll try another later and remember to disable the VPN next time as that has a bearing too.
 
Mark, thank you for those results.

Could you run a speed test again now please, to the Speedtest.net Namesco (London) server, if possible.

Here's what we're getting right now for reference:

 
I can reproduce what you're seeing. The dial flies up initially, then drops, then goes up.. this is worse than ADSL even here ;)

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Maybe that server is congested, so try another..

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This accords with the 6 Meg you were seeing. I've never seen it this poor.

I seem to remember reading that the ThinkBroadband speed test does a multi-thread test. If the results of the HTTPx6 down are much higher than the overall result, this indicates congestion.

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Except this is showing it's the other way around. Although it doesn't show on the graphic - the page says "Your HTTPx6 speed is low compared to tbbx1. This suggests a PC or software problem".

Of course this could just be congestion. Half a dozen people streaming TV might cause this. It's later in the day now.

But the weird behaviour of the network which began last year seems to persist. I currently have a 3 bar signal when it's normally 5 bars and just prior to running those tests, throughput died altogether for about 3 seconds.

Aha - I wonder if it's this..

Check this page:
http://www.thinkbroadband.com/download/

I tried the "test files". Ports 80 and 81 return miserable speeds in the region of 3 to 5 Meg. Port 8080 jumps straight up to 10 Meg.

I wonder if it's some form of traffic management. As far as I recall, the only thing that Three publicly state as traffic managed is P2P. But then you'd have thought that port 80 might be optimised over port 8080 wouldn't you.
 
What I'd like to try is a "One Plan" SIM with unlimited tethering allowed to see if those accounts higher priority.
 
For some more insanity..

If I execute a query against a remote SQL Server database - which is port 1433 - I see around 8 Meg as the results come down.

In the meantime, port 80 is barely working.

It's like it's traffic managed but someone put the rules table in the wrong way around.
 
Indeed.

From a quick Google, it does appear that Three more heavily traffic manage PAYG accounts, which both yours and mine are.

I'm going to see if I can get hold of my brother's contract SIM to see if that sees the same behaviour.
 
Providers can be a bit vague about traffic management.

However from what I have read, dongles don't have the same traffic management as when tethering - the latter is supposed to be strangled whereas the dongle - as a means of primary access - is not meant to have the same restrictions imposed.

Our tests would seem to disprove that theory.

We're also outside of the hours when it is supposed to be implemented.

I wonder if running repeated speed tests is what makes it kick in.

It's all a bit of a mystery.

Relevant thread I found - but it's quite old

http://forums.digitalspy.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1668167

We average about 30GB to 50GB per month on EE - usage skyrocketed when partner got an iPad. Since I've reverted back to Three (when that broke) I've used about 8GB as we haven't watched any streamed films, just some YouTube on the TV.

Whatever the problem is, it kicked in about this time last year, and just a few months later we moved to EE.
 
In this kind of situation I would give up and setup a VPN on an unusual port.

Tom - www.mouselike.org

Mine was perfect here until I disabled the VPN to run those last tests. As you can see from the ISP name, it was switched on earlier.

Now, when I turn it back on, the behaviour is equally poor as if I've been "blacklisted".

The VPN (which I never normally disable) may be significant.

But then why on earth would port 80 be traffic managed and port 1433 not...
 
What I see now:

A speedtest.net speed test flies up to 3Meg, hesitates, then drops back and sticks solidly at 1.8Meg.

I wish I hadn't turned off the VPN now ;)
 
I don't know if it has anything to do with how much you download per hour. I'm constantly running speed tests so I don't know if that's making a difference.
 
Document on Three website:

http://support.three.co.uk/mobiledo...e/our_network/TrafficSense_facts_document.pdf

We use video optimisation to change the way video content is streamed to your device to make it play better. We use it to improve your streaming experience if our network is busy where you are.

So if I play this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C03688ZPAe8

The speed flies up to 9Meg to 11 Meg as it pulls down "chunks" of that HD video having auto-selected HD 720p (the highest version available).

We watch stuff like this on the TV and since it's shared using Windows ICS I can see the actual LAN throughput on my PC which accords with this.

So an unscientific anecdotal view is that port 80 (web pages) and speed tests get throttled whereas streaming video does not.
 
.. and even more insanely..

That video starts at about 11 Meg to pull the first chunk, then settles down to 2 to 3 Meg consistently. Doesn't sound too wacky for a 720p stream.

If I run a speed test while it's doing that - up to 3 Meg, then down to 2 and settles there.

The aggregate is about 6 Meg.
 
What might prove this, is having another Three PAYG SIM and swapping over to that.

If it has placed our two SIMs on the "naughty step" then the behaviour of the third would be revealing.

On instinct alone - multiple people maxing out the connection with speed tests around the same time causes traffic management to kick in.

Maybe that's what changed about a year ago. Back then I didn't use a VPN. Using Three with a VPN seems to behave which is why I thought - on returning - that it's "fixed".

Today I disable it, and it's all gone to pot as it did back then.
 
Mark,

What I am going to to is to get hold of my brother's 3 contract SIM to see if that shows the same behaviour.
 
I never did work out the issue before, but I think I'm beginning to see it now..

I think it's some kind of traffic management at work. In part, anyway. They call it "Traffic Sense" but it makes no sense.

At about 14:40 the network went away altogether for about five minutes here. Connection dropped, status page "No Network". Came back with a five bar signal.

Run speed test - 6 Meg.

Run speed test while simultaneously downloading a test file on port 8080 - speed test doesn't budge from 6 Meg, but the total throughput is 11 Meg.

This is pants. Compared to what it used to be like until a year ago, anyway. Which is when and why I stopped using it. Having 6 Meg down and 2 Meg up is like pulling teeth and makes everything tortuous exacerbated by those "pauses" and drop-outs. I would have a moan at Three, but to be honest it's not really worth it. I'll just get some guy from India trying to flush the temporary files in Internet Explorer.

According to the Vodafone coverage map, their 4G is due in the next three months too.

Hmmm. just going to post this, and "No Network" again at 15:34. Really? 5 bar to zero bars? "There is something wrong here".
 
I see the Vodafone coverage map. 4G in Winchester where I go to College is also a bonus.

We seem to be getting it before Farnham which is always nice.
 
Are you (Alec) using this today? It has worked flawlessly unlike the useless pile of turd it turned into the other day. Have run tests when I've thought to remember, about one an hour.

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When it was good, it was very, very good, but when it was bad..
 
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