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City Fibre Totton

noid

Member
Hi,

Does anyone know anything about City Fibre deploying in Totton Hampshire? I can't find any reference to it. I know Toob are supposed to be expanding into the area but the guys rodding the ducts today had City Fibre livery on their vans
 

baby_frogmella

Top Member
It doesn't appear on Cityfibre's rollout map here

 

Mark.J

Administrator
Staff member
ISPreview Team
Exactly where in Totton did you see those vans noid? As in, what street/lane? I can then take a closer look. But yes, at present CityFibre are not doing FTTP in the Southampton area (it was removed from their plans a couple of years ago), only Openreach, Virgin Media and toob seem to be the main players.

However, there has been talk of CityFibre potentially acquiring toob, but we've yet to see a solid update on those rumours. Another possibility is that CityFibre might be upgrading or fixing their existing Dark Fibre network in the area, which is used to serve the public sector and business clients (not homes).
 

MrJeeves

Casual Member
I have a tool that visualises the onenetwork data a bit better for working out if there's anything local. It also tries to interpret the data from Cityfibre checker. I guess both will help here. https://bidb.msh100.uk/

The caveat being I can't get PIA data
Hah, I have a similar site myself, but not as nice as yours.

All the work is done client-side because it's honestly just easier for what I'm doing.

Mine auto-updates as you move the map, which yours doesn't seem to do, but I also don't show road closures like you do. :)

 

Msh

Pro Member
Hah, I have a similar site myself, but not as nice as yours.

All the work is done client-side because it's honestly just easier for what I'm doing.

Mine auto-updates as you move the map, which yours doesn't seem to do, but I also don't show road closures like you do. :)

I got a bit fed up with checking and comparing multiple sources of data, I guess the intent of yours is quite different, hence it not updating when you move around. I am not trying to recreate one.network specifically.

The reason it's server-side is because of those very specific checks it runs throughout (all Lambda of course ;))
 

MrJeeves

Casual Member
I got a bit fed up with checking and comparing multiple sources of data, I guess the intent of yours is quite different, hence it not updating when you move around. I am not trying to recreate one.network specifically.

The reason it's server-side is because of those very specific checks it runs throughout (all Lambda of course ;))
Mine is mainly for exploring new telecom build areas. It was more focused on mobile networking (hence the domain name) until more recently where some people asked me to expand it into fibre deployments too.

I should really make it server-side because OneNetwork will probably catch on at some point with the Origin header being from my site... šŸ™ˆ
 

noid

Member
Exactly where in Totton did you see those vans noid? As in, what street/lane? I can then take a closer look. But yes, at present CityFibre are not doing FTTP in the Southampton area (it was removed from their plans a couple of years ago), only Openreach, Virgin Media and toob seem to be the main players.

However, there has been talk of CityFibre potentially acquiring toob, but we've yet to see a solid update on those rumours. Another possibility is that CityFibre might be upgrading or fixing their existing Dark Fibre network in the area, which is used to serve the public sector and business clients (not homes).
Hi,

They were working along Jacob's Gutter Lane SO40 9FU area
 

D Glasgow

Casual Member
I have a tool that visualises the onenetwork data a bit better for working out if there's anything local. It also tries to interpret the data from Cityfibre checker. I guess both will help here. https://bidb.msh100.uk/

The caveat being I can't get PIA data
Nice. But... You report my address as Openreach FTTP "planned". I see where you got the data but its not true. Ask the Openreach site directly and there are "no plans". Ditto CityFibre.

I see PIA building near my address. CF are going to use the OR ducts and that shows on your map. Or did you mean something else?

Other point of note re One Network, even if I select to look ahead 12 months I never see that data. The other roadworks site does show CF - for example - building in further streets later in the year. These never show on the ON site
 

Msh

Pro Member
Nice. But... You report my address as Openreach FTTP "planned". I see where you got the data but its not true. Ask the Openreach site directly and there are "no plans". Ditto CityFibre.
That information comes from https://www.openreach.com/fibre-broadband/where-when-building-ultrafast-full-fibre-broadband

I don't make this data up :D complain to OR if it's inaccurate (probably is). It's processed and updated by my API every 12 hours (I believe it's the only piece of data that is not fetched in real-time on request).

I see PIA building near my address. CF are going to use the OR ducts and that shows on your map. Or did you mean something else?
Most of the time they don't, I have seen other cases where they do. It's definitely not 100% the case.

Other point of note re One Network, even if I select to look ahead 12 months I never see that data. The other roadworks site does show CF - for example - building in further streets later in the year. These never show on the ON site
Their presentation of the data is different but the source is the same unless you give me specifics (dm maybe?) I can't answer this. There are probably additional filters they add.
 

D Glasgow

Casual Member
I don't make this data up :D complain to OR if it's inaccurate (probably is).

Sorry, was't meaning to be critical. As I say, I see where your getting that data from. You have to do a very fine grained house by house check to get the full story.

Where are you getting your postcode data from? It's slightly off for my address. I'm sure I was looking at mobile coverage maps the other day and it was spot on. Oh yeah, the mobile coverage is very handy, thanks! I didn't know there was any 5G in my neck of the woods!
 

D Glasgow

Casual Member
Where are you getting your postcode data from?
Oh, I went and RTFM. It says
  • Improved address matching. Right now the address matching logic is quite dumb. This could definitely be improved however this may be a fair amount of work and there will always be edge cases.
So now I know!
 

Msh

Pro Member
Sorry, was't meaning to be critical. As I say, I see where your getting that data from. You have to do a very fine grained house by house check to get the full story.
I know you're not, and I agree (the response was a bit blunt, sorry :D). I have just considered removing it so it just says live/not-live.

Where are you getting your postcode data from? It's slightly off for my address. I'm sure I was looking at mobile coverage maps the other day and it was spot on. Oh yeah, the mobile coverage is very handy, thanks! I didn't know there was any 5G in my neck of the woods!
The postcode data comes from maxbox, it sort of centres on the postcode itself (annoyingly, despite them passing a number and postcode to geocode), I have tried to get it more specific but I think I'll need to maintain a database to do that. The UPRN database would be great here.

The importance of accurate pinpointing has only just become a problem since I didn't have cellular coverage checks on there before.

Edit: bit more context to address matching:

Upon house number and postcode entering, the tool will geocode (turn an address into long/lat). Once that request has a result, it'll fire off all the checker queries (none of the fibre checks needs long/lat so that could probably start earlier, but the geocode could be seen as some basic validation too).

The fibre checks all require both the number and postcode and in almost all cases (excluding Openreach, I'll talk about that in a moment), the provider will return a list of addresses from a postcode search, it's then my APIs responsibility to choose the right address for the user (this is the part I have described as dumb). If the API can't make a perfect match, it'll take the first from the list and add a "looseMatch" entry (if you search with a fake number on a street, you'll see triangles next to the results, that's this logic happening). The query then takes place on that property it chooses.

The cellular checks all require a long/lat, and just return a rating from 0-4 (0 being no service, 4 being best). These queries depend on the providers and I have noticed they do lag quite far behind reality. It's good for a first glance look, if it says you have service, you probably still have service.
Regarding address matching improvements, I have been thinking of using Openreach's checker more aggressively for this. They take the number/postcode and make this address matching decision themselves. As part of the result, there's a UPRN. A few other providers (definitely not all) can query on this UPRN. It's also possible to get a perfect long/lat mapping from UPRN with a free database from OS. Instead of using Mapbox, the flow could change to use that first and take advantage of their data to geocode. It'd also improve the efficiency of the checkers that can utilise a UPRN.
 
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