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FTTPoD - near network trial

NotADog

Casual Member
I requested a quote (paying the £250 survey fee) via Cerberus when the near network trial started in December. Previously Openreach had not been able to provide a desk survey for some reason.
The quote came back as £2620.00 + VAT. I'm not sure how that lines up with the two possible costs under the near network trial (£1625 or £2650), especially as it includes things such as the Cerberus connection charge. It is supposed to be under the near network trial according to Cerberus, and they say it was the first quote they had under the trial.
We have WBC FTTP (but no CBT) on our nearest pole (which has our copper service). The fibre connects some houses further up the lane. The Openreach surveyor had been told to check in a joint box in the verge about 300 m away, so I assume we will get a new splitter in there.
 
I'm looking into FTTPoD now as well. After re-reading ISPReview's article it looks like the near network thing isn't going live until March?

Anyway, £2.6k is peanuts for FTTPoD. I would jump at that today if that were my quote.
 
For FoD that really is surprisingly affordable. If you pursue it, then I'd be keen to know what the final engineer's survey quote says (assuming they still do that under the trial).
 
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For FoD that really is surprisingly affordable. If you pursue it, then I'd be keen to know what the final engineer's survey quote says (assuming they still do that under the trial).
What do you mean “final engineer survey” Mark? I read it as the OP paid the survey fee, had the physical survey and got the final quote back - the same process as any other FoD - are you suggesting there is another further stage of quote?
 
Wow, I'd jump at it! See what other people have been paying for FTTPoD prior to the new pricing here.

Edit: I expect the quote is on top of what you've already paid, so £2870 total. I guess it's £2650 plus a reduced Cerberus commissioning fee or with some other minor adjustments, although the standard deductions apparently don't apply.

Anyway, congratulations!
 
I'm looking into FTTPoD now as well. After re-reading ISPReview's article it looks like the near network thing isn't going live until March?
The article links to the briefing and from there you can get to the price list notification.

"Eligibility for inclusion in the trial are orders received and acknowledged with a KCI1 date between 01/12/2021 and 31/05/2022 inclusive only."

KCI1 is "order accepted", i.e. has passed basic validation and been accepted into systems. For FoD I'd expect that's when the initial order is placed, i.e. you've paid your non-refundable £250+VAT and this triggers the survey.

The date of 19th March 2022 is for the expansion of FoD coverage, i.e. allowing FoD orders to be taken outside of FTTC areas.
 
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This is the final surveyed quote @Mark.J Total is £2620 + £250 survey fee + vat. I couldn't get a desk estimate. And yes, paid and waiting for the build. Process was just the same as any other FTTPoD survey. Openreach surveyor polite, not in any rush, asked if we minded an overhead fibre to the house (copper is ducted). Took photos etc.

The £2620 includes the Cerberus commissioning fees etc.
Looking at the quote again I think it is as follows (thanks for the suggestion that Cerberus fees are in addition to the Openreach costs, @candlerb ) :

Openreach £1625 (so that lines up with the near network trial, and means just a CBT needed, not a splitter)
BTW connection charge £495
Cerberus connection charge £500
Sub-total £2620
Survey fee £250
Total £2870 + vat

So the total is £3.4k inc vat, but as others have said, we don't have expensive holidays etc, and I need a good connection for work. So well worth it from my perspective.

Our neighbours whose copper comes from the same pole now have KCI2 Assure status on the BTW checker (so subject to survey they can have WBC FTTP). Oddly so can two other houses (different pole) who previously couldn't, I think because they are near the joint box (?) unless it is an error. The neighbours wouldn't have paid, so I couldn't make it cheaper that way unfortunately. Of course, they will all have to wait the same unknown time that we will for the build to actually take place, but hopefully a CBT isn't that difficult as there is already fibre in place, and no road closures needed.
 
Thanks for updating with the cost breakdown.

This helps others in similar position to understand what their total outlay will be with the various (not insignificant) connection charges, under this scheme.

Good luck with the construction - hopefully it won't be too long as you 'only' need a CBT.
 
So around three months after requesting a quote (and a bit over two months from placing the order) Openreach have fitted an 8-port CBT to our pole (and another one to the previous pole).
So very much "near network" as it didn't need any more than about 2 m of the fibre the CBT comes with to terminate in the enclosure which was already on the pole.
Apparently now a two week delay while "some equipment" is allocated in the exchange. Never sure the Openreach people know exactly what is happening somewhere else in the network though.
 
2.5 months is still lightning fast for FTTPoD, but by the sounds of it there was not very much for them to do in reality!

I just looked at my own costs again, from September 2018 -

Build charge & connection costs £3,450 + VAT (after £3,000 DCMS voucher available at the time)
Survey fee, £250 + VAT

There was quite a lot of work for them to install, so I feel like I got something of my money's worth and it will now be coming up to 3 years since it went live, so again I feel vindicated from the perspective that a native FTTP build wasn't in the offing and would erode that large investment. In any case I think it will be another few years at least before it's rolled out in the village, let alone the farthest flung outskirts.

Hope you are happy with the service when its finally ready.
 
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So around three months after requesting a quote (and a bit over two months from placing the order) Openreach have fitted an 8-port CBT to our pole (and another one to the previous pole).
So very much "near network" as it didn't need any more than about 2 m of the fibre the CBT comes with to terminate in the enclosure which was already on the pole.
Apparently now a two week delay while "some equipment" is allocated in the exchange. Never sure the Openreach people know exactly what is happening somewhere else in the network though.
Putting kit on poles is the easy bit, the routing back to the head end exchange and allocation of equipment is the difficult part, your head end exchange could be 20 or 30 miles away or more, and your feed will be different to the one used by the existing customers further up your lane.
 
Putting kit on poles is the easy bit, the routing back to the head end exchange and allocation of equipment is the difficult part, your head end exchange could be 20 or 30 miles away or more, and your feed will be different to the one used by the existing customers further up your lane.
Under the arrangements of the Near Network Trial, his connection will be using the same splitter (hence the charge without OR having to build a new splitter just a new CBT), so how exactly will the feed different to existing customers served by the same splitter node?

There is no way the headend exchange will be 20-30 miles away. GPON has a maximum specified distance limit of 20 km and OR are usually much more conservative so it likely to be 10-12 miles tops.

It may just be a different PON (port of the OLT) which is straightforward.
 
There are many exchange areas much further than 20km cable run, Wisbech for example covers Upwell and Christchurch, St Ives feeds Chatteris.
If things get too far, Sub Tended head ends extend that range even further.
As far as the splitter goes, there may be 1 or 2 SASA’s fitted, but if you need to fit another, that will need proving back the whole run to the OLT. If you’re lucky, it’s spliced all the way back, if not, someone has to do it back to the Agg node then do the exchange work.
 
Hi,
Under the arrangements of the Near Network Trial, his connection will be using the same splitter (hence the charge without OR having to build a new splitter just a new CBT), so how exactly will the feed different to existing customers served by the same splitter node?

There is no way the headend exchange will be 20-30 miles away. GPON has a maximum specified distance limit of 20 km and OR are usually much more conservative so it likely to be 10-12 miles tops.

It may just be a different PON (port of the OLT) which is straightforward.
The range of GPON is very unclear to me.

G984.1 quotes three ranges:
- Clause 8 - Logical Reach of 60km, which I assume is used as a design basis for timing on the link and cannot be exceed without breaking it.
- Clause 9 - Physical Reach of 20km (or 10km depending on optics). I assume that this is driven by the optics in use and the amount of splitting - see below.
- Clause 10 - Differential fibre distance of 20km, this is the maximum distance between the closest and furthest remote nodes. It is not clear why this is quoted if the physical reach is actually limited to 20km, unless repeaters are envisaged.

Whilst clause 9 suggests a range limit of 20km, I believe that improved optics have allowed the physical reach to approach the logical reach. See https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.p...-compact-fttp-broadband-ont-and-mini-olt.html and the related comments which suggests that a 58km range is viable with a 4 way split.

What is not clear is what Openreach's internal design rules say. Openreach might be working to a 20km maximum range (or more likely a maximum loss) to allow for the introduction of new technologies with tighter requirements for example.
 
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Just to complete the story on my Near Network Trial experience, it's now all done and working well.

A short timeline:
01/12/21 Paid for Field Survey via Cerberus
06/12/21 Openreach site survey
21/12/21 Confirmed build charge received and accepted
...a lot of waiting, estimating and planning and some activity including fitting the CBT and confusion over duct or overhead to the house, then finally...
04/04/22 BT Wholesale checker says WBC FTTP available
29/04/22 ONT and drop cable fitted in one visit and working.

So 5 months almost to the day. Though there might have been some headend equipment required, all that was done was within the terms of the near network trial (just the CBT). There was an existing joint and fibre to the splitter. This was confirmed by talking to an Openreach engineer who had designed the PON in our area.
It seemed that they were going to use our existing duct, but as it would have needed some civils then this caused a delay while they thought about it, before going overhead.

One of the conditions of the trial is that "Orders requiring civils work or presenting DIG (direct in ground) infrastructure" cannot be considered for the trial pricing.

I think the trial pricing is still open to the end of this month.
 
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