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How to find out if the 5G is enabled on a mast.

I believe it's fairly widely accepted that Three's map (currently) underestimates their 5G coverage, whereas other providers over estimate theirs (looking at you EE).

For once they're not over promising and under delivering. This combined with the stop-sell of home broadband in postcodes that are over subscribed already does make it feel like they're getting their act together - probably due to the new upper levels of management changes over the past year.
 
I believe it's fairly widely accepted that Three's map (currently) underestimates their 5G coverage, whereas other providers over estimate theirs (looking at you EE).

For once they're not over promising and under delivering. This combined with the stop-sell of home broadband in postcodes that are over subscribed already does make it feel like they're getting their act together - probably due to the new upper levels of management changes over the past year.
I wish theyd get their CS and returns policy together too🙄. I have just returned my 5G hub and gone back to 4G. They are saying that they have lost it in their warehouse and it's my fault and that I didn't post it when I have given them my tracking number and it clearly says on the RM website "Delivered". They are now asking me for £500 and threating debt collection for their problems. Customer support keep trying to 0 balance the account and tell me to keep ignoring the letters and phone calls I am recieving.

EDIT: hmm, the photo below is interesting, why on earth would they do that??? (Sarcastic tone)
 

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5G doesn't have to come from the same mast as the 4G connection - it could be from a different mast in the area.

Hi @GavinAshford ,

Where does this quotation come from?
I have seen it posted a lot in the forums, by many different people.
I am wondering if there is any technical knowledge of this, or if its a quote that's been copied and pasted over the past few months.

It is true that you can get Uplink from the eNodeB on a lower band such as L8 L18 etc.
Whilst keeping your downlink on the higher band, usually 3.5Ghz.
This is called DL UL decoupling.

They do however have to be co-located sites.
You cant just grab uplink from Site A and Downlink from Site B.

The eNB is providing Control plane, and the gNB is userplane.
However they are phycially connected via either baseband backplane, or cpri/ethernet 10Ge.

They do have to be co-located nodes.
 

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Hi @GavinAshford ,

Where does this quotation come from?
I have seen it posted a lot in the forums, by many different people.
I am wondering if there is any technical knowledge of this, or if its a quote that's been copied and pasted over the past few months.

It is true that you can get Uplink from the eNodeB on a lower band such as L8 L18 etc.
Whilst keeping your downlink on the higher band, usually 3.5Ghz.
This is called DL UL decoupling.

They do however have to be co-located sites.
You cant just grab uplink from Site A and Downlink from Site B.

The eNB is providing Control plane, and the gNB is userplane.
However they are phycially connected via either baseband backplane, or cpri/ethernet 10Ge.

They do have to be co-located nodes.
As far as I understand, with NSA 5G, this is exactly what happens - the diagram you attach shows this exact situation.

The eNB (4G) connection provides the control plane and its own downlink and the uplink (...usually, if the providers haven't enabled NR upload), and gNB provides the 5G downlink channel, which is potentially from a physically separate, but network-interconnected, site.

For NSA 5G its almost better to consider the 5G connection as another carrier aggregation of 4G, with the potential of that 5G connection being provided from a separate site to the 4G connection - inter-node aggregation.
Inter-node aggregation is also defined for 4G, but no carriers in the UK deploy it.

However, saying this, it depends on the provider/vendor. Three do this, but for O2, I believe their deployment of 5G must have the 4G anchor and the 5G coming from the same physical site (intra-node, not inter-node)
 
Well I've now managed to get it to just under 600Mbps down, but seem to be hitting a cap at 70Mbps up. I've had will over 750Mbps down if only few a couple of minutes, which surprised me. Very happy, even without bridge mode, maybe I'll find a work around.
 
Well I've now managed to get it to just under 600Mbps down, but seem to be hitting a cap at 70Mbps up. I've had will over 750Mbps down if only few a couple of minutes, which surprised me. Very happy, even without bridge mode, maybe I'll find a work around.
The 70Mbps up could be because of how Three are scheduling the uplink across 4G/5G, or maybe what slots they've allocated to it. n78 5G is TDD (time-division-duplex) and so only every n-th slot is for uplink, unlike in FDD (frequency-division-duplex) where the whole frequency can be used for uplink. The slot allocation is certainly configurable, though I don't know if its responsive/dynamic based on load requirements.

I would also caution that you probably should expect speeds to reduce over time as the 5G user-base grows - I'd expect you're just one of a few users at the moment so getting a lion's share of the capacity.
 
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I would also caution that you probably should expect speeds to reduce over time as the 5G user-base grows - I'd expect you're just one of a few users at the moment so getting a lion's share of the capacity.

I already mentioned that I expected this somewhere else, but luckily I think it will be sometime before we hit a high saturation point in my area, and my contract will be up and FTTP will be at my door by then.

I will certainly be reporting back if/when I see the speeds drop off, or go up (if that is possible).
The 70Mbps up could be because of how Three are scheduling the uplink across 4G/5G, or maybe what slots they've allocated to it. n78 5G is TDD (time-division-duplex) and so only every n-th slot is for uplink, unlike in FDD (frequency-division-duplex) where the whole frequency can be used for uplink. The slot allocation is certainly configurable, though I don't know if its responsive/dynamic based on load requirements.

That is interesting, I can tell it is hard capped simply by how well it stays fixed at the 70Mbps speed, no fluctuations at all, just a wall like when I set QOS on my router for a machine one the network.
 
It could also be a hard cap, known as AMBR, where your provider sets the speed limit for your account/profile, but without a rooted Android phone and NSG I don't think you can get visibility of that value. Virgin Mobile's implements this (on EE at least) and they set 85down/25up
 
It could also be a hard cap, known as AMBR, where your provider sets the speed limit for your account/profile, but without a rooted Android phone and NSG I don't think you can get visibility of that value. Virgin Mobile's implements this (on EE at least) and they set 85down/25up
BT set 30 down 5 up. This cap is removed if you have BT Halo and lifted to 60/20 if you pay them £5 for double speed 4G.
 
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As far as I understand, with NSA 5G, this is exactly what happens - the diagram you attach shows this exact situation.

The eNB (4G) connection provides the control plane and its own downlink and the uplink (...usually, if the providers haven't enabled NR upload), and gNB provides the 5G downlink channel, which is potentially from a physically separate, but network-interconnected, site.

For NSA 5G its almost better to consider the 5G connection as another carrier aggregation of 4G, with the potential of that 5G connection being provided from a separate site to the 4G connection - inter-node aggregation.
Inter-node aggregation is also defined for 4G, but no carriers in the UK deploy it.

However, saying this, it depends on the provider/vendor. Three do this, but for O2, I believe their deployment of 5G must have the 4G anchor and the 5G coming from the same physical site (intra-node, not inter-node)
Hi Gavin,

That's what I mentioned actually.

The downlink and uplink have to come from the same colocated tower.

You can not use the uplink from physical site A and downlink from physical site B.
 
Hi Gavin,

That's what I mentioned actually.

The downlink and uplink have to come from the same colocated tower.

You can not use the uplink from physical site A and downlink from physical site B.
When you say colocated do you mean physically separate sites but ones that but connected/in communication with eachother on the network side?

Because that's how the EN-DC part of 5G works.

Edit: I should also add that while the upload can be scheduled to flow over the 5G connection, it's also possible it'd go over the 4G connection, and in that scenario the upload could be to the 4G site, along with the control data, with the (bulk of) the downlink capacity being provided by the 5G site. This is what I mean when I say that the 5G connection might not come from the same site as the 4G connection (for Three at least, but not, AFAIK, O2)

The 2mins or so of this video (from 51:50) probably explains it better than I can through text.
 
Last edited:
Well not quite had the CPE Pro a week but super happy with the performance of the modem/antennas inside of it.

After some shifting around, I am now seeing a constant 700+ Mbps download regardless of the time of day. I am somewhat hesitant to get an external antenna now, but I want to be able to move the router and still get the performance I am seeing ,so it seems I have no choice or it will be stuck in front of my window in a weird place for ever. :)

Not solved the issue about having no bridge mode yet, and still need t figure out how I can forward my ports to allow access to my Plex server remotely, and my NAS both of which are on the same network. I really am starting to replenish those skills I haven't used for a good while.
Any tips appreciated!
 
@Blu3fire if no bridge mode, then your best bet is to put your old (wifi) router, if you still have it, in the DMZ and do your port fwd from there.

If the 5G router works well in that location and gives you 700Mbps all day any day, DO NOT MOVE IT, FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! :-)
 
@Blu3fire if no bridge mode, then your best bet is to put your old (wifi) router, if you still have it, in the DMZ and do your port fwd from there.

If the 5G router works well in that location and gives you 700Mbps all day any day, DO NOT MOVE IT, FOR CRYING OUT LOUD! :)

Thank you for the advice, I'll set my proper router to a static IP then, just whack that in the CPE DMZ and ask should be good, need to wait until the evening is over as too many users in the house and I fear the wrath if the internet goes down for any time at all. xD

I don't want to move it, but it's an eyesore, I've taken measurements to the nearest mm from each wall and floor to ceiling so I'll be able to put it back if my antenna idea fails, can't do it until best the end of March anyhow as I've spent my IT budget the month.😂
 
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Well not quite had the CPE Pro a week but super happy with the performance of the modem/antennas inside of it.

After some shifting around, I am now seeing a constant 700+ Mbps download regardless of the time of day. I am somewhat hesitant to get an external antenna now, but I want to be able to move the router and still get the performance I am seeing ,so it seems I have no choice or it will be stuck in front of my window in a weird place for ever. :)

Not solved the issue about having no bridge mode yet, and still need t figure out how I can forward my ports to allow access to my Plex server remotely, and my NAS both of which are on the same network. I really am starting to replenish those skills I haven't used for a good while.
Any tips appreciated!
I'm not 100% sure what happens with using an external antenna, but there is a chance in doing so you'll reduce your maximum number of streams from 4 (4x4 MIMO) to just 2 (2x2) because there are only 2 external connectors - I believe when using external antennas the router disables the internal ones, but I don't have, or have seen, any first hand experience of that.

If that does happen and you were getting all 4 streams before to achieve those speeds, you could halve your speed when using an external antenna.
 
I think you can use internal and external antennas at the same time, my B535 lets you do that.

You can but then it tells you that you can only use one of 2 antenna ports. At least on the B818. Not really sure why.

818antenna.png
 
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