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Needing help in making a PC

Hello, I know that there are many pc owners that read these forums and are very able at making PCs, sadly I lack in these skills but instead I am going to pay to have one built. The only thing is, is the parts and I want good parts naturally. Secondly, I have the basics like the monitor and casing and cd-rewriter etc (basically an upgrade but a new PC at the same time).right so my specifications are as follows :

Moterboard: Well I don't know anything about these but guess the person making it will adapt it to what I ask for- hope not too expensive though for what I would like.

Processor: I think an Athlon, they seem cheaper to buy and have one currently and have done ok so far the options avaliable to me are: Athlon XP 3200+ or AMD Athlon 64 3200 I am not sure which is better and if so if there is any major performance differences....any suggestions on something that will last a couple of years?

Hard drive: Was thinking of an 80GB Diamondmax one (about £50)

Graphics cards: Now this is one I am not sure about, I read the big debate about RAM and graphics cards in the other forum and don't know a great deal about them. Which would be good for a gamer, I read in a PC Zone that the Radeon 9800 Pro 128MB is good, but is this an ageing card....are the cards of the future 256MBs now?

Sound Card: I know sound is important but to me it isn't vital..any suggestions?

Finally for RAM now, I have 256MB of it, I guess I could add it to my new Pc, but I would like 512MB- 1GB in my new Pc ideally.

Thanks alot, I know it's a hard task, but I think I can only stretch to a budget of around £500- I hope providing everything else like the mouse, keyboard, monitor etc will keep the cost lower.

thanks alot and any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Nicholas
 
nicholas3000 said:
Processor: I think an Athlon, they seem cheaper to buy and have one currently and have done ok so far the options avaliable to me are: Athlon XP 3200+ or AMD Athlon 64 3200 I am not sure which is better and if so if there is any major performance differences....any suggestions on something that will last a couple of years?

I'd go for AMD, as they generally offer a far better price/performance ratio.

The Athlon 64 is 64-bit capable. This will only make a difference for programs which are specifically written to use the 64-bit capability. However, Microsoft hasn't even release a 64-bit version of Windows yet, so at present it is useless. I think Win64 is due for release near the end of the year, or even early next year, but knowing Microsoft, the next ice age could arrive first :).

Basically, you need to decide whether you will want to take advantage of 64-bit as soon as it is available. Personally, I think that if you are sure you only want the PC to last a couple of years, I wouldn't bother with the 64 just yet, as it will take time for developers to fully utilize it, plus the cost of 64-bit processors is likely to go down once it is more widely used.

nicholas3000 said:
Sound Card: I know sound is important but to me it isn't vital..any suggestions?

I use a cheap soundblaster card, which is functional but not spectacular (but then I'm not a PC gamer) - is it not possible to use you old card and only upgrade later if you decide it is necessary?

nicholas3000 said:
Finally for RAM now, I have 256MB of it, I guess I could add it to my new Pc, but I would like 512MB- 1GB in my new Pc ideally.

Whether or not you can use your old RAM depends on whether you new PC takes the same type of RAM as your old one - if it doesn't then you will have to start from scratch.

Get as much as you can afford - remember that you can always upgrade this in a couple of months if you find buying the rest of the kit leaves you financially challenged.

I looked into doing something similar myself a little while ago, and I think you could end up with a pretty powerful machine for £500, especially given that you don't need a monitor.
 
For the Motherboard, if you want to go the AMD route, may I suggest a motherboard that has the nForce 2(AMDXP) or nForce 3/Pro (AMD64) Chipset as they seem to be more reliable than thier VIA counterparts, Dont (i cant say this strongly enough) get a SIS based motherboard, they are more trouble than thier worth..

For the CPU, AMD AthlonXPs are actually coming to the end of their production soon so personally I'd go for the AMD Athlon64, that is however, if you want to go the Athlon Route. but may I point out, AMD64's are a LOT dearer..

For the Hard Drive, 80GB may sound huge but you would be suprised how fast it goes, I'd go for a 160GB SATA drive myself (if the motherboard supported it), Also Maxtor are not very good in my opinion, I would say Seagate or Western Digital are the drives to go for.

For the Graphics, this is the tough 1, How much are you willing to Spend :eek: the Radeon 9800 Pro is a VERY good card but has been superceded by the 9800XT and the X800 series (which costs a small fortune) the other route you could go is nVidia and thier FX series but get a 5950 minimum (and XT in nVidia terms is the cheap version unlike the ATI Radeons)

for the Sound Card, I'd say Creative Audigy 2, Very nice sound card, Try and get an OEM version, will be cheaper :)

RAM: 1GB Minimum PC3200 DDR, Crucial Branded are good

Also you have to get some decent cooling as AMD's run hot..

Hope that helps :)
 
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I build pcs for freinds and family, and am also starting a small business, just something to keep me occupied. Im not offering to build you one (unless your local ;) ) but basically it all comes down to what you want to use it for, and how much you have to spend.

If you answer those 2 questions, I will knock up a basic quote saying what you would get for it, just so you got a basic idea.
 
A lot of what makes a good PC depends on your individual needs but taking your criteria here is a outline of a machine that should keep you happy for a number of years -

a) Processor - there is little in it in cost terms so you may as well get a AMD Athlon 64 3200 (not a big difference to the 3000 in performance terms from what I've heard, and the 3000 is cheap). It won't be too long (1-2 years ?) before 64-bit is the norm and 32-bit drops by the wayside for the consumer. Advantages to AMD 64 are some speed improvements in 64-bit mode plus addition of the NX bit which prevents software exploits. Shame most low end AMD 64 motherboards don't have more than 4 gigabyte RAM capacity (64-bit allows massive address space), which is no different to the average 32-bit motherboard.

b) The motherboard is key to a great PC. For AMD 64, socket 754, I think I'd go with this (I nearly bought one a number of months ago) - http://www.ebuyer.com/customer/prod...2hvd19wcm9kdWN0X292ZXJ2aWV3&product_uid=54502 - GA-k8VNXP - which is _crammed_ with features. Unless you can find something similar with a/the newer nvidia chipset.

c) Hard drive - buy what you can afford, remember hard drives are falling in price all the time and you can always add a much bigger second drive in the future. SATA has some nice features in some of the _latest_ drives.

d)Graphics cards - not my area though mid-range ATI cards seem to be popular.

e) Sound - often built onto the motherboard, again not something I ever get excited about. You might want a specific/popular card if you were going to run something like Linux.

f)Memory - buy a minimum of 512 megabytes and purchase more as and when you need it. Like hard drives you won't lose out by waiting.

Basically motherboard and processor are key - the foundation to a great system with a long useful life - get the motherboard right and everything else falls into place. :)
 
nicholas3000 said:
Hello, I know that there are many pc owners that read these forums and are very able at making PCs, sadly I lack in these skills but instead I am going to pay to have one built. The only thing is, is the parts and I want good parts naturally. Secondly, I have the basics like the monitor and casing and cd-rewriter etc (basically an upgrade but a new PC at the same time).right so my specifications are as follows :

Moterboard: Well I don't know anything about these but guess the person making it will adapt it to what I ask for- hope not too expensive though for what I would like.

Processor: I think an Athlon, they seem cheaper to buy and have one currently and have done ok so far the options avaliable to me are: Athlon XP 3200+ or AMD Athlon 64 3200 I am not sure which is better and if so if there is any major performance differences....any suggestions on something that will last a couple of years?

Hard drive: Was thinking of an 80GB Diamondmax one (about £50)

Graphics cards: Now this is one I am not sure about, I read the big debate about RAM and graphics cards in the other forum and don't know a great deal about them. Which would be good for a gamer, I read in a PC Zone that the Radeon 9800 Pro 128MB is good, but is this an ageing card....are the cards of the future 256MBs now?

Sound Card: I know sound is important but to me it isn't vital..any suggestions?

Finally for RAM now, I have 256MB of it, I guess I could add it to my new Pc, but I would like 512MB- 1GB in my new Pc ideally.

Thanks alot, I know it's a hard task, but I think I can only stretch to a budget of around £500- I hope providing everything else like the mouse, keyboard, monitor etc will keep the cost lower.

thanks alot and any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Nicholas


I would go for the Athlon XP. There are currently as far as I know no programes that support the AMD 64 functionality. I doubt that it wil be of much benefit to games in any case. The Athlon 64 will be quite a bit cheaper. I suspect the motherboard will be as well.

Sound Card any reasonably soundblaster will give you excellent results

With regards to the Case & PSU without knowing what you currently have I cannot be sure of compatability with a modern motherboard

I think you are skimping on the hard disk particulary with regards to the rest of the spec. I would go for at leasy 120Gb

You may well need new memory. 512kb should be more then adequate.

Graphics card depends how much of a gamer you are. You could pay £300 for the latest all singing and dancing one.

Heatsink & Fan chances are you will need a new one

The sort of spec you are implying may well blow your £500 budget you may need to make some adjustments to your spec to suit the budget


You may need to junk some other bits of your kit if you have any IA cards current MB's have no slots for them.

Unless you are having a friend build it there will be a charge for assemblying it. My guess is perhaps £50 but its a guess.

The highest price part could be the Graphics card. If you are not a gamer you can get a good card for about£50 but one suitable for a gamer would probably be at least £150
 
Web Buddy said:
... There are currently as far as I know no programes that support the AMD 64 functionality. ...

Windows XP Service Pack 2 has/will have NX "No Execute" technology built in - this is only available on AMD 64-bit chips at the moment (until Intel clone the instruction set for their processors properly).


Additionally, Microsoft is working with microprocessor companies to help Windows support hardware-enforced "no execute" (or NX) on microprocessors that contain the feature. NX uses the CPU itself to enforce the separation of application code and data, preventing an application or Windows component from executing program code that an attacking worm or virus inserted into a portion of memory marked for data only.


I'm interested why you prefer the XP (£132) over the 64-bit equivalent (3200 - £155 / 3000 - £110) when they come in around the same price and 32-bit will soon be yesterday's technology for the PC ? :)
 
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Thank you for your comments so far they have been very helpful :) I think I am basically left with the AMD XP 3200 processor and if it probably won't affect games for some time (possibly even a couple of years) then it should be ok. It does suggest however that next time I need an upgrade I will need to get a new motherboard again (I suppose this is commonplace though). I noticed that the 64 bit processors are expensive as well- and the motherboards that support them to boot.
If I get a 3200 XP though, and a good graphics card that should hopefully make up for lost ground. I like the look of the ATI Radeon 9800 pro and would never be able to afford a £300 one, any other suggests as to what might be a good combination- also I noticed there is the ATI Radeon 9800 Pro 256MB and the ATI Radeon 9800 Pro 128MB does the 256MB against the 128MB mean it'll be a better graphics card?
I think a cheaper soundblaster is good as a soundcard too. Last PC I had did have a SIS motherboard with intergrated graphics- as another poster has pointed out- that was a bad idea!
I will get the most RAM I can, I have heard about DDR RAM but am not sure what the differences are and what is really the best for the price (possibly opened up a point there which might be confusing for me)

Really, like everyone else, I want to play a variety of games, such as half life 2, the sims 2 (which I know gets a lot of stick the sims series from the gaming world :p ) and the movies (which might not need a high end PC, but it's nice to know it's there just in case a game like Lord of the rings: The battle for Middle Earth pops up! )

Thanks for your help, your comments are very useful!

Nicholas
 
Have a look at www.planetmicro.co.uk these guys sell pc parts at rock bottom prices and they deliver quick too. As for putting it together, it is simple, I built my first one from scratch without any help or problems and its a sin to see people being charged a fortune for someone putting one together. It really is a case of simply plugging it all together and if you have an old one to look at while doing it, they are basically all the same. Software setup is almost the same. Maybe a member who's near could help out, if there are any. :)
 
Stupid me, I didnt see the £500 budget in the first post.

£500 isnt a lot for a gaming computer I must admit.

It would help if you can say if you already have anything, and the only things that would be worth bringing over would be the monitor, speakers, keyboard and mouse.

If its an old computer you may not even bring over the keyboard and mouse.


I will do a spec for a £500 base unit, to give you an idea of what you can expect. Remember tho, this is without any labour, so whoever your going to may charge more for the same thing, and have different part prices.
 
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Here's an example:

DURON 1600 SYSTEM KIT

Contains:
1x 256MB PC2100 DDR DIMM MEMORY MAJOR
1x 3 IN 1 BLACK KB+SPKEARS+SCROLL MOUSE
1x DELUXE 350W MIDI TOWER ATX CASE
1x 17" GNR VL770 (BEIGE) CRT COLOR MONITOR 3YR OSW
1x SAMSUNG 52X32X52 IDE CD-RW OEM + SOFTWARE
1x AKASA AK-785-SE 2.1GB AMD APPROVED
1x AMD DURON 1600 SOCKET A CPU
1x 40GB MAXTOR 7200RPM UDMA133 IDE HDD
1x ASUS A7N266-VM N-FORCE DDR VGA+SND+ MICRO ATX
1x 3.5" BEIGE FLOPPY DISK DRIVE (INTERNAL)


This is available on the planet micro site at the moment and whilst it isn't top spec, its not bad.

Or hows this for ready built;

Processor: AMD K7 ATHLON XP 2600 PLUS RETAIL 266FSB CPU
Fan: AMD K7 ATHLON XP FAN
Motherboard: ASUS A7N-8X-VM N-VIDIA 8X AGP+400DDR VGA+LAN+SND
Memory: 512MB PC2700 333 DDR
Hard Drive: 120GB GXP 7200RPM IDE
CD: DVD BLACK 4X +/- R DVD WRITER
Video Card: N-Vidia VGA Graphics
Case: ZORRO BLACK MIDI TRNS SIDE PANEL
Floppy Drive ? BLACK FLOPPY DISK DRIVE
Modem 56K V90
Network Card Integrated 10/100 LAN
Sound Card Integrated Sound
Warranty 1 Year RTB Warranty

Price:£469.94 inc vat


Hope this helps,

keith
 
Last edited:
Hmm. Keith, I gotta say that last one is a bit sparse on details. What processor speed?

What model nvidea card?

Anyways, heres what I did off of ebuyer.co.uk, not the greatest customer service, but huge stock and cheap.

For £430 inc VAT, this would leave you with a:

Athlon 3000 (not 64bit) (and a good cpu cooler)

512mb ram, DDR 400

Asus motherboard, with onboard 6 channel sound, LAN, USB 2.

Sata drive, 160GB

radeon 9800 pro, 128mb

and a case with a 350watt PSU.



I left out the following assuming you have them:

Optical drives: cdrom, dvd players, writers etc

Floppy drive

Obvious cables (power etc)

Monitor, speakers keyboard and mouse.

And of course, operating system.


That gives you £50 worth to use on whatever, labour, new optical drives, etc etc.


Being a gamer myself, thats the minimum I would have for a gaming machine. Halflife 2 will most likely need more ram (another 512 stick would be good).

Ignore the minimum specs on the games packets, thats total crap. Half the time they dont even run on the minimum systems, and when they do it jerks like hell.

The graphics card is the main thing for games, its just making sure everything else can keep up. The 9800pro is a good card, and should be able to deal with any games out at the moment.

If you need anymore help, just shout.


Edit: ahh Keith, you edited it ;) . The 233 FSB on the chip will slow down the ram compared to what it could do. And unless the nvidea card is a recent one, which I doubt for that price, its not going to be good enough for games.
Good machine for general use tho.
 
keithcalder said:
Processor: AMD K7 ATHLON XP 2600 PLUS RETAIL 266FSB CPU

I thought the 266fsb version of the XP2600 only had a short production run before switching over to 333fsb.
I've certainly not seen any of these advertised anyware for quite some time now.
 
Thanks for the estimate Old dude and indeed keith calder too, I do have all the other bits like the keyboard etc- the current pc is 3 years old too so the sort of things like needing a new keyboard shouldn't be a problem. I looked up RAM prices too and looked quite expensive, but I could buy one stick and then update later. It would be good really to get a AMD 64 I feel but again the cost is quite high....maybe if I wait a couple of months (but there is always something newer coming out ;) )
Old dude, just one question, I noticed you said it would be a minimum gaming system, is this partly due to the processor? (as I know the graphics card isn't the absolute bestest one already)

thanks and hopefully this time next year I can get broadband as well! :)

Nick
 
No, I myself am running a 2800 athlon, and my games have no slowdown at all.

But the price difference between a 3000 and 2800 isnt much at all, so its probably better to go for the 3000.

Im not sure if you know much about FSB speeds, but they do help a bit.

Very basically, there is 3 speeds of memory (for DDR). There are faster ones coming out but they are not about much yet, so ignore them for now.

Theres 266 (or 233, cant remember and Im doing this on the fly), 333, and 400. Even if you get a 400mhz stick of ram (doesnt matter about the size, be it 256mb to 1gig) it will only go as fast as the processor.

The 3000 athlon has 400 FSB, so would allow your memory to run as fast as it can (assuming you got a 400mhz stick).

In short, its better off to buy a 3000 processor.

512mb ram is ok, but it does have its downsides. When I had 512, after playing farcry, doing anything at all was very very slow, as all the memory had been used up. A reboot sorted it of course, but you can see how over 512 ram is useful.


Hope this helps and that it wasnt too geeky. Anything else dont hesitate to ask. ;)


Oh yes, and NEVER be tempted to buy cheap ram. Always use branded types, such as crucial etc. These are not much more, and are much more reliable than the others. I know this through much expirence.
 
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My CPU is a 333MHz Ver of the 3000XP (Barton) and my RAM is 1GB PC3200 (400MHz) of which it Is running at 400MHz Dual Channel ;) mind you, My CPU Is OverClocked :o and is running at 2.5GHz :D
 
Just been talking to my friend on the phone in canada about my pc situation, he offered to bring a processor from there over to me or maybe send it when he visits. If I asked him to get a motherboard as well, is it the same as buying it hear except more reasonable because of the exchange rate? Would it be needing US parts instead if the machine was finished off here?

thanks,

Nick

The explaination on the FSB was explained well as I understood it too ;)
 
The motherboard and processor will work - they just run off a standard UK power supply - so no you won't need specialist parts. I think the last time I checked there weren't massive differences between U.K. and U.S. (for instance) prices for low end parts - higher end kit is another matter. If your friend posts the goods from Canada you will pay import VAT on the declared value (if it's over about $50) and you may also be charged by the courier e.g. Parcel Force (£8) for simply processing the items. Simpler to buy low end equipment here in my opinion. :(
 
Dude you forgot the case!

Possibly the current one is ok, but I would think its better to have more than a 300 watt Power Supply Unit.

Otherwise, thats a good system. From my exprience, the onboard sound on motherboards is good enough for all but the most picky of people.

Nick3000, if you want buy the parts off ebuyer and people on here will be able to talk you over the installation process.

Would be cheaper than you getting it built by someone.
 
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