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When you say "attaching a phone" do you mean physically plugging in a landline phone and using a VOIP service or do you mean using your mobile phone with WiFi calling via the router?

Blocking VOIP doesn't make sense, unless they are also your VOIP provider and they've cancelled the VOIP service. Blocking WiFi calling makes more sense, it still seems as if there are a fair few deals that don't include WiFi calling.

My guess is that it's WiFi calling you may be referring to, and not VOIP, is that right?
Jsharris What it is, yes I attach/ed a landline phone but calls where part of the everything unlimited phone SIM
 
Jitterypinger what I had with Three was a mobile phone SIM in a Huawei mobile router.--I'm interested to know why a mobile Broadband SIM without calls costs the same as a mobile phone SIM that does. If each costs the same they should receive the same
Usually that's because of providers having FUPs for standard mobile phone SIMs and restricting people using routers on them. Sometimes through regular tethering, I think they also have device limits.

Meanwhile, for mobile broadband SIMs, there shouldn't be a FUP and obviously it has to allow your router.
 

insertfloppydiskhere I'm not against fair use. I've never owned a real mobile phone so that I could understand both sides of the problem. I just see a mobile phone SIM with every thing unlimited costing the same as a mobile router SIM with unlimited data only unlimited costing exactly the same. This does not look very fair to me​

 
Jsharris What it is, yes I attach/ed a landline phone but calls where part of the everything unlimited phone SIM


So who were you using as a VOIP provider?

For example, I have a Mikrotik 4G router that at the moment is using a Lebara (Vodafone) SIM. They don't offer a VOIP call or charging option, so I have my VOIP number contract with Andrews & Arnold. A&A charge me £1.44 for the VOIP equivalent of line rental (really just managing the number) plus call charges that vary from around 1p/minute to 1.5p/minute.

Other VOIP service providers offer packages, where call charges are included. We rarely make landline calls (it's primarily an emergency phone as we can't get mobile reception in the house) so the A&A VOIP package made most sense.

Did the 3 SIM include a VOIP service and call charging package originally? I assume so, based on what you've said. Sounds as if 3 may have withdrawn the VOIP part of the deal, which they can do. We will lose our landline phone in the next year because our broadband provider (Plusnet) is not going to provide a VOIP service. They still provide a legacy wired landline service at the moment but that will change to broadband only (SOGEA) before too long.

Means that every Plusnet phone customer will lose their landline phone unless they do as I've done and set up a VOIP service with another provider. I could just as easily use our FTTC broadband to connect to the A&A VOIP service - all it needs is any reasonably good internet connection, doesn't matter how that's provided. I chose not to do this only because our FTTC broadband fails shortly after the start of any power cut, so doing that would leave us with no working phone for emergencies.
 
Jsharris No VOIP, just attach the landline phone via rj 11 and use the sim phone number minutes and sms


That is using VOIP (Voice Over Internet Protocol) though. The RJ11 on a router is just an analogue telephone adapter (and 50V DC supply) that takes analogue audio and turns it into a digital format that can be used on the internet connection - i.e. it's VOIP.

Looks like your SIM package included the option to make VOIP calls using your landline phone and the router ATA, using your mobile number as if it were a landline, is that right?
 
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Sounds to me like the router config has blocked the calls from working for some reason.

I'm assuming the calls work with O2
jitterypinger to save looking back the same privately bought router had a three mobile phone unlimited sim with a phone attached via rj11. This worked 100% for nearly 2 years.---An O2 Sim also unlimited is not a problem.---Even using the Three everything unlimited sim in another router works 100%
 
It sounds very much as if the 3 SIM you had included a VOIP option that allowed the use of a landline connected phone as if it were a mobile phone. The VOIP call option seems to have been withdrawn by 3, which sort of makes sense as there are big changes afoot with the shutting down of the copper wire telephone network over the next year or so.

Those providers offering VOIP calls may be rejigging things ready for the influx of former landline customers as the copper wire phone system gets shut down. Right now things are definitely a bit confusing, as I found when trying to get ahead of the game by testing VOIP options before we lose our landline.
 
jsharris there is confusion here. No voip here, calls are covered by minutes and sms that are part of the sim card


If you are plugging an analogue phone into a router then you are using VOIP. You may choose not to believe this, but the fact is that your router is doing a bidrectional analogue to digital/digital to analogue conversion, adding the 50V DC for the landline phone, all over the pair in the RJ11.

Your service provider is then enabling that VOIP connection to work as if it were a mobile phone connection.

In your case, based on what you've posted, 3 were including a VOIP call package in their SIM (which appeared as if it were a mobile in terms of charging) and now they are not.
 
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If you are plugging an analogue phone into a router then you are using VOIP. You may choose not to believe this, but the fact is that your router is doing a bidrectional analogue to digital/digital to analogue conversion, adding the 50V DC for the landline phone, all over the pair in the RJ11.

Your service provider is then enabling that VOIP connection to work as if it were a mobile phone connection.

In your case, based on what you've posted, 3 were including a VOIP call package in their SIM (which appeared as if it were a mobile in terms of charging) and now they are not.
jsharris I didn't know that as there was not a voip option in the menus, but if that is the truth I'm now a wiser man, fair enough
 
jsharris I didn't know that as there was not a voip option in the menus, but if that is the truth I'm now a wiser man, fair enough

I think there are going to be a LOT more issues like this that crop up as the old copper line phone system shuts down, TBH. By December 2025 all landline phone users are going to have to switch to VOIP, and right now there does seem to be a lack of clarity from some phone and broadband providers as to how they are going to deal with this.

Some are just refusing to provide phone coverage after the shut-off date, some are refusing to accept new landline phone customers now. Few seem to be clear as to what they are going to do, although BT seem to be the exception as they are rolling out an integrated router/ATA and also providing the needed battery backup unit to allow calls to be made when there's a power outage.

Seems likely there will be a fair few teething problems as VOIP rolls out, not least because of the need to set up a VOIP service, which can be somewhat harder than just plugging a landline phone into a master socket.

In your case I think you may have run into a legacy service issue. Voice calls over the mobile network can be made in several ways. The obvious one is a mobile using the network directly, but even this has two ways to connect. A mobile can use the legacy voice calling system (been around for a very long time) or it can use the newer VoLTE (Voice over LTE) protocol. Because a mobile connection is now pretty much just an internet data connection, it can also carry VOIP traffic.

If I had to predict what will happen, then I think that almost all voice traffic will migrate to VoLTE/VOIP, with the legacy 2G network carrying a small volume of voice and low speed data traffic. Sooner or later I think even the venerable 2G network will have to shut down, but that problem is rather like shutting down the copper line phone system, in that there are a lot of 2G users (albeit not many of them at the domestic consumer level).
 
jsharris an intresting paper there. I ditched traditional phone a couple of years ago because of uncontrolled joke prices from service providers.
Now I just plug a landline phone into the router's rj11. It just works, I just informed the service provider that I have an android device rather than an apple device that uses volte.
3g voice can depend more on how good the signal to the mast is.
4g volt I've not used very much but early days say better.

I'm sirprised that 2g is not at the same funeral as 3
 
I'm sirprised that 2g is not at the same funeral as 3

Far too many legacy users of 2G, including millions of smart meters and other bits of IoT stuff. Just replacing the comms units on smart meters (at least in the south of the UK - those in the north connect using a 400MHz band dedicated network) is going to take years.
 
Far too many legacy users of 2G, including millions of smart meters and other bits of IoT stuff. Just replacing the comms units on smart meters (at least in the south of the UK - those in the north connect using a 433MHz dedicated network) is going to take years.
jsharris the reason it 'is going to take years' is because there is no incentive to hurry things along. Anounce a sale/ auction of the 2g frequencies to take place in early 2025 and things would soon gallop along
 
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jsharris the reason it 'is going to take years' is because there is no incentive to hurry things along. Anounce a sale/ auction of the 2g frequencies to take place in early 2025 and things would soon gallop along

2G uses the same bands as 3G/4G, and doesn't use a lot of bandwidth. It'll come down to cost versus benefit, and the cost of replacing tens of millions of legacy 2G IoT devices is going to be very high, and take a long time.

Every single smart meter installed in non-LRR parts of the UK will need to have its communications hub replaced. That's almost as big a job as fitting the things in the first place, and isn't going to happen overnight. It's taken a decade to get to where we are now with the smart meter rollout, and will take close to as long again to replace all those millions of communication hubs.

On top of that there are all the other IoT devices that need replacing as well, ranging from remote telemetry used by the utility companies right across the UK, to tens or hundreds of thousands of other sensors and controls used by everyone from wildlife and nature conservation bodies to trackers used on vehicles, etc.

All this stuff can be replaced with 4G compatible connectivity, but it will take a lot of time. Someone also has to foot the bill for it.
 
2G uses the same bands as 3G/4G, and doesn't use a lot of bandwidth. It'll come down to cost versus benefit, and the cost of replacing tens of millions of legacy 2G IoT devices is going to be very high, and take a long time.

Every single smart meter installed in non-LRR parts of the UK will need to have its communications hub replaced. That's almost as big a job as fitting the things in the first place, and isn't going to happen overnight. It's taken a decade to get to where we are now with the smart meter rollout, and will take close to as long again to replace all those millions of communication hubs.

On top of that there are all the other IoT devices that need replacing as well, ranging from remote telemetry used by the utility companies right across the UK, to tens or hundreds of thousands of other sensors and controls used by everyone from wildlife and nature conservation bodies to trackers used on vehicles, etc.

All this stuff can be replaced with 4G compatible connectivity, but it will take a lot of time. Someone also has to foot the bill for it.
jsharris everything is paid for by the ordinary joe/ jane in the street.
How long something takes is down to the motivation, my house is on fire how long do I take to contact the fire department.....The local cinema has a good film on that ends tomorrow, I am not paid untill two day after, what do I do...
 
Are people going to stomach another increase in their energy bills right now to pay for replacing their meter comms hub, at a few hundred pounds per unit (including installation labour and old unit disposal cost)?

We've already had the costs of the original smart meter rollout added to standing charges, plus we've had an almost doubling in standing charges caused by bailing out all the failed suppliers, will people really tolerate another step increase to cover the cost of replacing 2G/3G smart meter comms units with 4G capable ones (they aren't ever going to be 5G for good reasons associated with the laws of physics). I doubt anyone has the appetite for increasing energy bills by doing this anytime soon, TBH.
 
Are people going to stomach another increase in their energy bills right now to pay for replacing their meter comms hub, at a few hundred pounds per unit (including installation labour and old unit disposal cost)?

We've already had the costs of the original smart meter rollout added to standing charges,plus we've had an almost doubling in standing charges caused by bailing out all the failed suppliers, will people really tolerate another step increase to cover the cost of replacing 2G/3G smart meter comms units with 4G capable ones (they aren't ever going to be 5G for good reasons associated with the laws of physics). I doubt anyone has the appetite for increasing energy bills by doing this anytime soon, TBH.
jsharris at those unproven costs, not a chance. Make do with what we have
 
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