Openreach [FTTC] to CityFibre [FTTP]

[RubyDarling]

Hello I hope every one is well & looking forward to xmas soon?

Currently I am on BT social tariff essentials with unlimited digital voice and upto 76Mbps.

I am a carer for another family member which is why have landline they wont switch to using mobile (this means require landline and call package with included allownace not pay&go)

It appears to be FTTC with digital voice (BT advanced phone trio are connected to the hub with trucalling features this does come in handy do not want to lose these features either)

We are finding the speeds are to slow for so many in the household and Noone are available in the area on CityFibre offering FTTP.

The bit I am confused about is on Noone ordering section it mentions this in red when selecting phoneline

"At the moment there is no migration path between Openreach and CityFibre.
We advise customers not to cancel their existing Openreach broadband until the new CityFibre broadband is installed."

Does this mean can't transfer number? or need to order broadband only and leave phone with bt who do offer social tariff for only phone or another option?

Thank you to any one who can give some advise it's very confusing.

 

[Koda]

You SHOULD be able to keep your number. But you shouldn't cancel your services with BT. You need to keep the BT account active, get the new CityFibre line installed, and then ask the new provider to take over the phone number from BT. Once that has been done, you can then make sure BT have fully closed the account.

It just means that they can't do the fully automated switching like you can from one Openreach provider to another where you don't need to contact them yourself.

Just don't say anything to BT for the time being. Because if you give notice to cancel service it puts a cease order on the line, and nobody can take over the landline number if there is a pending cease in place.

If your chosen broadband provider can't take over the number, other providers will be able to. For example I have my broadband and phone separate. My landline is now on it's own from A&A, and they successfully took over my BT number without issues. A&A Is pay as you go, but landline calls are only 1.5p per minute. So unless you are a particularly heavy user with outgoing calls it often works out cheaper than a calling plan anyways.

And if all else fails, BT have their home essentials plan for landline only at £10 per month. But this will still be digital voice based so you'll have to keep the BT hub plugged in to the Openreach line to use the phones with.

 

[Anth]

I wouldn't use your ISP for your VOIP service. You are forcing yourself to remain with them no matter what price increase they offer (and given this whole CPI + 4% per year nonsense means the prices will increase each year unless you switch away)

You also pay a lot more for the VOIP service with an ISP than what you would if you went to a dedicated VOIP provider.

I would suggest porting your number over to a dedicated VOIP service when Cityfibre goes live on your line. This will cancel your social tariff with BT and effectively end the copper line and thus you will then have FTTP with one provider and your phone with another.

A&A seem to be the best value-for-money VOIP service that most go for. There is also Yay and Voipfone to consider.

Most people after Sipgate stopped offering low-cost Basic plans now convert to A&A for Voip and just have whichever ISP they want for their broadband.

I would strongly recommend this route.

Another option to throw out there if you did the above. I found 5G speeds to be significantly higher than FTTC. If you port your number over to A&A you could get a 5G router and connect your landline to this. I get 150mb/s on 5G whereas I only got 36mb/s with FTTC. And I suspect I could get more than 150mb/s if I bought an external aerial for it

 

[RubyDarling]

I wouldn't use your ISP for your VOIP service. You are forcing yourself to remain with them no matter what price increase they offer (and given this whole CPI + 4% per year nonsense means the prices will increase each year unless you switch away)

You also pay a lot more for the VOIP service with an ISP than what you would if you went to a dedicated VOIP provider.

I would suggest porting your number over to a dedicated VOIP service when Cityfibre goes live on your line. This will cancel your social tariff with BT and effectively end the copper line and thus you will then have FTTP with one provider and your phone with another.

A&A seem to be the best value-for-money VOIP service that most go for. There is also Yay and Voipfone to consider.

Most people after Sipgate stopped offering low-cost Basic plans now convert to A&A for Voip and just have whichever ISP they want for their broadband.

I would strongly recommend this route.

Another option to throw out there if you did the above. I found 5G speeds to be significantly higher than FTTC. If you port your number over to A&A you could get a 5G router and connect your landline to this. I get 150mb/s on 5G whereas I only got 36mb/s with FTTC. And I suspect I could get more than 150mb/s if I bought an external aerial for it

ISP for broadband is a fixed price for 24 months.

Phone package is 1 month contracts.

No CPI increases. (This is one of the reasons I considered nonone internet)

Dedicated voip do not offer unlimited call pakages and looking at past few months the landline usage is between 600-1000 minutes per month (at pay&go rates this would be expensive)

New provider would be FTTP 900Mb each way and my area doesnt have 5g with all other provider excluding o2 unable to even provide 4g unless you go down the road in the open.

 

[RubyDarling]

You SHOULD be able to keep your number. But you shouldn't cancel your services with BT. You need to keep the BT account active, get the new CityFibre line installed, and then ask the new provider to take over the phone number from BT. Once that has been done, you can then make sure BT have fully closed the account.

It just means that they can't do the fully automated switching like you can from one Openreach provider to another where you don't need to contact them yourself.

Just don't say anything to BT for the time being. Because if you give notice to cancel service it puts a cease order on the line, and nobody can take over the landline number if there is a pending cease in place.

If your chosen broadband provider can't take over the number, other providers will be able to. For example I have my broadband and phone separate. My landline is now on it's own from A&A, and they successfully took over my BT number without issues. A&A Is pay as you go, but landline calls are only 1.5p per minute. So unless you are a particularly heavy user with outgoing calls it often works out cheaper than a calling plan anyways.

And if all else fails, BT have their home essentials plan for landline only at £10 per month. But this will still be digital voice based so you'll have to keep the BT hub plugged in to the Openreach line to use the phones with.

I wasn't going to cancel it I was going to order broadband and landline at same time which is why it was unclear if the new provider would activate the broadband line and then port it which cancels it without me needing to do anything.

or if i should only order broadband once that is working order the phone bundle.



I did look around at other phone providers but was unable to find one which offers call packages and when i looked at usage currently paying per minute would cost more.

 

[Anth]

Dedicated voip do not offer unlimited call pakages and looking at past few months the landline usage is between 600-1000 minutes per month (at pay&go rates this would be expensive)

Is it to friends and family members that you can convince to also convert to A&A as the calls are totally free to them if you do and the same for them phoning you also. This is from A&A's pricing page.

"If a call can be connected directly to one of our customers then there is no charge for the call"

I have the same with Sipgate. I got all my friends and family to also convert to it. In 2.5 years of using their service, I have only topped up once for £10. And I still have about £4 left of that £10. And we use the phone daily non stop.

You are basically getting a free phone service if you can get the people you phone to also port to them.

 

[jpm]

In a situation where the landline is important and the customer is happy with buying the service from their ISP, that is surely the way to go as it means no finger pointing if there are ever any problems with calls not getting through etc.

 

[RubyDarling]

Is it to friends and family members that you can convince to also convert to A&A as the calls are totally free to them if you do and the same for them phoning you also. This is from A&A's pricing page.

"If a call can be connected directly to one of our customers then there is no charge for the call"

I have the same with Sipgate. I got all my friends and family to also convert to it. In 2.5 years of using their service, I have only topped up once for £10. And I still have about £4 left of that £10. And we use the phone daily non stop.

You are basically getting a free phone service if you can get the people you phone to also port to them.

Not an option for the people who are being called to switch.

A large % of these calls are medical related or to people who either use mobile or have landlines which do not have option to move to a voip provider without maybe spending lot of money replacing equipment.

Unlimited calls is around £7 with noone & bt social tariff is £10.

A&A wouldn't work with current phones either would it and the true call etc function?

Thanks for posting the info it's useful to know for other people.

 

[Koda]

A&A wouldn't work with current phones either would it and the true call etc function?

If you use an ATA Device, or a router that can be configured for VoIP then yes you just plug your existing phones in to this and wouldn't need to replace the handsets you currently use. All the features like smart call blocking should continue to work too. As far as the average end user is concerned the actual experience of using the phone should be no different to what you get with BT right now.

 

[RubyDarling]

If you use an ATA Device, or a router that can be configured for VoIP then yes you just plug your existing phones in to this and wouldn't need to replace the handsets you currently use. All the features like smart call blocking should continue to work too. As far as the average end user is concerned the actual experience of using the phone should be no different to what you get with BT right now.

The device which is provided by noone is Mercku M6a does this allow that?

I couldn't find much info in UK about that.

 

[Koda]

The device which is provided by noone is Mercku M6a does this allow that?

I couldn't find much info in UK about that.

A quick google image search shows there’s no telephone ports on the back for connecting handsets to. So no it doesn’t appear to support VoIP in any capacity never mind user-configurable options.

I can only assume that noone offer a different router if you were to take landline services from them. Or they just send you an ATA if landlines are purely an afterthought of theirs.

I’ve never heard of Mercku before. It may be wise to prepare for their router to be a bit crap and plan for potentially having to get your own for good networking performance. On the plus side that does mean you're free to pick your own equipment and be sure that it's definitely VoIP Compatible.

 

[RubyDarling]

A quick google image search shows there’s no telephone ports on the back for connecting handsets to. So no it doesn’t appear to support VoIP in any capacity never mind user-configurable options.

I can only assume that noone offer a different router if you were to take landline services from them. Or they just send you an ATA if landlines are purely an afterthought of theirs.

I’ve never heard of Mercku before. It may be wise to prepare for their router to be a bit crap and plan for potentially having to get your own for good networking performance. On the plus side that does mean you're free to pick your own equipment and be sure that it's definitely VoIP Compatible.

I contacted them about it they said ata will be included.

I take it ata is an adapter which plugs into ethernet port and phone goes in other end not another device?

I had not heard of that brand but when i did a bit of searching it appears to be fairly new to UK been around in US for a while with many positive reviews with only two issues price is close to other well know brands and only wifi6. (It looks far better to standard other ISP give out for free)

 

[Koda]

I take it ata is an adapter which plugs into ethernet port and phone goes in other end not another device?

Unfortunately it's another device and will need it's own power socket too. Nothing huge, but probably not as simple as you have in mind either.

One of the most common ATA Devices available right now is the Grandstream HT801 Which is 10x10x3cm in size. Just to give you an idea.

 

[Zephyri]

We've already got voip from Noone, they provide a HT701. It's not very big, does require a power socket as already mentioned, but otherwise it is just ethernet to the router, phone cable to your old phone.

The router is fine, definitely one of the better "ISP" routers I've had, for a normal user the only downside might be the lack of ethernet ports, there's only two LAN (+ 1 WAN port), which isn't enough really.

 

[RubyDarling]

We've already got voip from Noone, they provide a HT701. It's not very big, does require a power socket as already mentioned, but otherwise it is just ethernet to the router, phone cable to your old phone.

The router is fine, definitely one of the better "ISP" routers I've had, for a normal user the only downside might be the lack of ethernet ports, there's only two LAN (+ 1 WAN port), which isn't enough really.

Thanks for info and yes only 2 ethernet is poor not sure why they are not giving out the model which has 4 (I understand if it's 2 port if purchasing the extra externder)

are ata devices fine to be plugged into network switches?

I keep seeing it's for analogue phones mine are DECT\GAP phones does this mean it wont work wth them?

Holding Page | EE Store

store.ee.co.uk

It's confusing I am not a technology person.

I take it none of this equipment they are providing would work with other voip providers if i later on wanted to move the phone away from noone?

 

[Zephyri]

Thanks for info and yes only 2 ethernet is poor not sure why they are not giving out the model which has 4 (I understand if it's 2 port if purchasing the extra externder)

are ata devices fine to be plugged into network switches?

I keep seeing it's for analogue phones mine are DECT\GAP phones does this mean it wont work wth them?

Holding Page | EE Store

store.ee.co.uk

It's confusing I am not a technology person.

I take it none of this equipment they are providing would work with other voip providers if i later on wanted to move the phone away from noone?

The ata adapter they provide can be attached to a switch, yeah. It's also not ISP specific, you can go into it and change the settings. That said, I'm pretty sure they'd want it back if you cancelled. I don't think you own the equipment, especially since it's 1 month rolling. You'd have to ask, I guess.

As for those phones... Are they specific to BT or is it just using a normal phone cable? Did you buy them yourself or did BT give them? If BT gave them you as part of the contract they might want them back if you cancel your phone line similar to what I just said about the noone equipment. It's hard to find information about them, apparently some newer BT phones are specific to BTs digital voice, but I'm not sure if those are? If it's a normal phone cable that can also work with traditional "copper" phone cables, I don't see why it wouldn't work in an ata adapter.

These days you often have to read the fine print about equipment ISPs give you, most of them consider them "loans", so if you move away, they'll want them back.

Edit: I checked the manual for those phones and it seems like it is just a old bog standard phone cable. In that case it would fall under the "analogue" bracket. The point being when you plug it in at the wall, it would go over the old copper analogue cables, hence "analogue" phone.

 

[RubyDarling]

The ata adapter they provide can be attached to a switch, yeah. It's also not ISP specific, you can go into it and change the settings. That said, I'm pretty sure they'd want it back if you cancelled. I don't think you own the equipment, especially since it's 1 month rolling. You'd have to ask, I guess.

As for those phones... Are they specific to BT or is it just using a normal phone cable? Did you buy them yourself or did BT give them? If BT gave them you as part of the contract they might want them back if you cancel your phone line similar to what I just said about the noone equipment. It's hard to find information about them, apparently some newer BT phones are specific to BTs digital voice, but I'm not sure if those are? If it's a normal phone cable that can also work with traditional "copper" phone cables, I don't see why it wouldn't work in an ata adapter.

These days you often have to read the fine print about equipment ISPs give you, most of them consider them "loans", so if you move away, they'll want them back.

Edit: I checked the manual for those phones and it seems like it is just a old bog standard phone cable. In that case it would fall under the "analogue" bracket. The point being when you plug it in at the wall, it would go over the old copper analogue cables, hence "analogue" phone.

thanks for that info it was confusing because of the phones being called digital and the ata device analogue.

Yes the new ones provided by bt are locked to only the router they provide cant be used with anyone else this was offered for extra £ had no interest in them.

Thanks for every ones help I have ordered the internet through noone and going to keep landline with bt until I know the new internet service is up and running and try to port in later when I know internet is running fine (I will continue to look at the other options as well)