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Peer to peer

TonyBrown

Regular Member
Rob,

Maybe Aramiska just have a translation problem, for 'shaping' maybe we should read 'strangling' ;-)

Regards

Tony
 

robwil

Casual Member
Thanks for your speedy reply Tony. Strangling now there's a thought..........reality check..........no it's a good idea !

Downloaded a song last night (Winmx)on my dial up. A very respectable 3.47kbps. At the same time I set off downloading a song on my super fast Aramiska " We don't restrict just Shape P2P traffic" connection and it's still sownloading now...nearly 24 hrs later....................Broadband ain't it great....I can't wait to read the PC friendly replies.....bring 'em on.

All the best and happy surfing.

RoB Williams
 

Satellite Stan

Pro Member
mmm

Rob,

Have you thought about call Customer services as they might have direc t anwser as to why you dial up is faster than you Aramiska conncection.

I knw from a sales point of view that p2p will work on our network, Fudski is the best person to give you the techie ins and outs of how to make it happen.

stan
 

robwil

Casual Member
Yes I will call them tomorrow and report my findings back here. As I said for surfing it's amazing, connections of about 1.5Mbps on average. My last Winmx download has only just finished 24 hours later. It's a record. At one point it got as fast as 0.15kbps....I can tell you're jealous !

Have fun

Regards

RoB
 

TonyBrown

Regular Member
Rob,

If you get any sensible suggestions from support, please let me know, and I will give them a try as well. It is easy for me to do back to back against ISDN since they are both installed here.

Just for your info, I had opened the incoming ports in the ARC which is recommended for good Peer to Peer with Emule. I did not do this with the ISDN firewall and still got fairly good results, so this is not a port forwarding issue.

Regards
Tony Brown
 

Fudskie

Pro Member
can i ask what connection you have installed?
ARC 500
ARC 1000
ARC 2000
ARC 2000+

Thanks
 

Fudskie

Pro Member
I am trying emule out.

i have punched a hole in my firewall (hardware) big enough for the world & this app is poor !.
I am not getting any transfer of files?
look up is fast
sources? (i pressume users with file) are loads

But nothing is coming down. This was a 2MB file of some obscure subject so as not to be popular but nope wont transfer?? I even looked at M$ stuff to make sure it was not the other user. Well i started 2 files at 2330 hrs & now it is 2353 hrs & not a thing has moved...........

I am on a 512 fixed line (not sat) & i have excellent pings to the server so not me i assure you.

Am i doing anything wrong? i have gone through the faq & all is fine so it is either the app or the servers are slooooow.
 

TonyBrown

Regular Member
I have PM'd Mark with some assistance. I suspect the main problem is the selection of an obscure file. EMule works best when it is a really common file, with lots of options to download from.

What generally happens is that the best sources for files like these are people who have only just starting using EMule. It downloads in 9Mbyte chunks, so for a CD size download (say 200+ MBytes), this is 20+ chunks. As soon as you have downloaded the first chunk, you become a source yourself (you cannot stop this). Since you only have one file shared, you are a good source. The ones that are really slow have hundreds or thousands of files, and are running tens or hundreds of transfers at the same time.
 

Fudskie

Pro Member
Shaping

The Aramiska network traffic shapes our services so as to allow performance to the majority of business related services. We are a business related ISP & this decision was taken after a large majority of or customers asked us to do this.

We traffic shape all our services using priority on the network for things like mail, ftp, http etc (not listed in order) this is to give our customers the service they were looking for we contractually agreed to.

We do not allocate bandwidth to certain services in the manner you are saying as this would be very hard to implement due to the nature of these adaptive services.

The reason for traffic shaping (different to restricting or allocation) is to allow things like web pages to be accessed when someone on the LAN decides to download a largish file say 150Mb. If the user was to start this download they would use the connection to its max bandwidth it will operate to thus anyone else on the network would not be able to use the system this is called shaping in its simplistic form.

To restrict bandwidth is to allow certain services a max bandwidth allocation so if say 5 people were on a download then they would get a max transfer rate equally as set by the restriction. This would also mean if one person was on the same connection with no other users then they would not be able to use the whole bandwidth to transfer the file but would also meet the max set restriction.



This is a simplistic view to this so no techie "but it means this" etc & "but this is not it in its entirety replies" etc.

As I am trying to be as simple as I can get with this explanation.
 

Fudskie

Pro Member
P2P

P2P is traffic shaped as i have mentioned. This is something being looked at & maybe it will be improved with shaping but we still have an issue with response times in the look up of the files , overhead latentcy issues with the p2p tunnel so it will never be as smooth as say a land line connection, this is pure physics of satellite technology. I would like to say this forum has highlighted this subject & we will be looking at this & discuss its merit & hopefully (p2p user myself) we will address this issue if not in its entirety but to a point to satisfy most users.

Regards
 

TonyBrown

Regular Member
Mark,

Thanks for your attempts to explain what Aramiska are trying to do.

I think what you are saying (and please correct me if I am wrong) is:-

1. Aramiska are traffic shaping by type of transfer (i.e. http, smtp) globally (at the Aramiska Ground Station). Shaping is not on a downlink basis (i.e. user shaping), although I think you may be doing this as well.

2. Shaping is by port number. I can't see what else you could be using.

3. Some peer/peer systems (like EMule) allow (and in fact recommend) you pick a non-standard port number. If you can establish a direct Peer/Peer connection using non-standard port numbers, you will then be a 'new' transfer type, thus breaking free of the shaping. However, this is bad for everyone, except the one doing the peer-peer transfer.

I agree wholeheartedly that the Aramiska service should be targeted at
providing best support for normal business activity. I admit to a bias on this one, since we are business users. When users are being sold WISP, are they being told this by their WISP supplier (which I guess is not Aramiska?). Maybe Rob would like to comment on this.

Regards

Tony Brown
 

TonyBrown

Regular Member
Just as a thought, is there any chance of Aramiska sharing the global transfer bandwidth breakdown, by type? I suspect they will say this is commercially sensitive. However, it would be interesting to know the proportion of the bandwidth that is being used by http, ftp, pop, peer to peer etc.
 

Fudskie

Pro Member
you are correct. we use port allocation but we do not shape locally on the ARC as this is not something we have done. No we do not issue any wireless stuff we only provide the back haul to the internet on our community service. You would be amazed how many people are using normal services like ARC500, 1000, 2000 for there communities & not using the ARC2000+ system. This is relevant as the ARC2000+ has no shaping in this form or any max min transfer etc or any fair user policy. I suspect most of the ones having these issues are not using the ARC2000+ that was released for these communities. In fact i know as i have looked in to them. The forum helps me on that cause people raise these things on open forums & i check the connections based on locality etc. Very useful personally. We state that the ARC2000+ is the ONLY system we allow contractually to allow these commercial services behind the connection so in theory we could disconnect all the non ARC2000+ communities but we wouldnt do that me thinks. So we are not as bad as we often get labelled "The big bad ISP Vs the little people" but hey not everyone knows the real story eh?.

Regards
 

Fudskie

Pro Member
i have not got the official figures but i think email is the highest & then http followed by ftp etc used by users.

----------------------------------

releasing the official figures is yep commercially sensitive & confidential but hey thats the way it goes eh. the legal dept & security dept like to keep some things to themselves or they would not be needed eh?. :D :laugh:

Regards
 

TonyBrown

Regular Member
You mean I should have sold some of my bandwidth to the local community!! And I though everyone would abide by your T&Cs like we do. :)

I am actually surprised that you are letting people resell the bandwidth on the standard packages, since your T&Cs specifically say you can't.
 

Fudskie

Pro Member
I know. But there you go. I think the intention is to covert them over later. I know you can not do it now but maybe we needed to measure the market place before releasing the community service. ;)
 

robwil

Casual Member
My a lot has happened since my last post....Thanks Fudskie and Tony. Tony I would like to comment......I run a small business from home over a Wisp...not too sure what we have I think 2000+ I'll get back to you. On top of my work needs I just happen to need to DL P2P stuff. My WISP never told me about any issues with P2P. He probably thought he nver needed to or maybe he didin't know about the problems.

Fudskie I think I understood your LAY explanation... Given as you say we're all given a given an amount of bandwidth to play with to make it fair for all other users, surely I should get a better DL from P2P than 0.15kbps. Am I missing something ? Sorry to be so dim.

Can we cut to the chase. Is this something that can be resolved ?

By the way Tony I've been so busy still haven't called Customer Services but will do and let you know their response...watch this space ! I'd really like to speak to Fudskie as an earlier post says he's the man. Would this be possible or would you have to kill me !

Thanks for all your help and once again sorry to be slow on the uptake.

RoB Williams
 

Fudskie

Pro Member
no talking is no issue i wont have to kill you LOL:D I use msn or yahoo to chat but i am mostly on the isp review IRC channel that is very good. get www.mirc.com loaded then go to irc.dynastynet.net 6667 then enter #isp-review or go to the web version on this web site with a browser on the chat tab above....
 
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