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Using your own ONT with FTTP

TTJJ

ULTIMATE Member
Thought I'd just share a link to something I bought and had success with recently on Aliexpress. It essentially just converts your fibre connection into standard Ethernet. Useful if you're with a restrictive ISP.

I don't like using the ISP supplied router, even when it's put in bridge mode. So, I used this instead and have had great success with it. I recently moved from a GPON network (I had a small Huawei ONT previously) to the upgraded XG-PON one so my old ONT wouldn't work - but then I found this one which supports basically all of the standards (X and GPON as well as the XG variants).

Depending on how your ISP authenticates, you can set the SN of the device, the LOID, GPON Password etc. and then just use either DHCP or PPPoE on your own router to connect.

Very useful indeed.
 
Often you can use a different ONT, but I'd say it's wise to avoid doing that, unless you're comfortable with the caveats and any advanced tweaking that may be required. Much will depend upon how the network is setup, both in terms of its kit and authentication.

Some FTTP networks like their OLT and ONTs to be from the same manufacturer (vendor lock-in), not only for commercial reasons but also to avoid unexpected bugs with interoperability. But this can vary as there are many different ways to build these networks, some of which are much more flexible than others.

The ONT may also contain a specific code/serial that is registered to the network and used for activation, which can make swapping out the ONT difficult unless you know how to clone those details to the new device (easier if you're using kit from the same manufacturer). But in time I'd expect all networks to become more flexible as they adopt software defined approaches:


However, I'd say the biggest issue to watch out for is on the support side. If you ever need support and you've swapped the ONT then you may be in breach of the service terms. This might work against you if, in the future, you needed to claim compensation for an outage or something like that.
 
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If the ONT is not validated by the network surely there is a security issue.
ONTs are validated and governed by the standards they support, and they don't really 'connect' to the network. That's what your router is for.

Most networks will have some sort of authentication for the ONT to ensure it's being used in the right place, such as with a password or serial number checks.
 
My concern is PON can be set up to different security levels for the shared broadcast and I would be concerned if network providers were compromising for simpler install and support. Theoretically a hacked IONT could listen to the broadcast.
 
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Ideally you should treat the ONT as being the "demarcation point" between the provider network and your own network. Anything up to and including the ONT is their problem and anything beyond it is yours.

If you replace the ONT with your own kit then it becomes a lot harder to correctly accuse the provider if there's a problem with the connection that is clearly and reproducibly on their side, as they will just point the finger back at you for replacing their equipment.
 
Just a bump here as I think this is relevant to the conversation.
Ideally you should treat the ONT as being the "demarcation point" between the provider network and your own network. Anything up to and including the ONT is their problem and anything beyond it is yours.

I think there's a fine line here. Yes, you're correct in that the ONT itself is the dmarc; fiber side is the provider and copper side is the user. However, when you run into issues like "what lights are on the unit?" No. Log into it and you tell me. If I'm physically required to assist in troubleshooting, then realistically the dmarc moves back a bit.

If you replace the ONT with your own kit then it becomes a lot harder to correctly accuse the provider if there's a problem with the connection that is clearly and reproducibly on their side, as they will just point the finger back at you for replacing their equipment.

Yes and no. While this falls to the user to be proficient, the user needs to actively troubleshoot with the provider anyway. And in my case, I'm proficient enough and willing to take this on. I'd rather have direct insight into the ONT. I'd rather have logging capabilities that I can store and provide after the fact. I'd rather know that their side stopped sending light or otherwise didn't negotiate something. While I can see things like not able to receive an IP from my FW's perspective, is that a head end issue, was there some issue between the OLT/ONT, or between my device and ONT?

You give me the fiber, and I'll take care of the rest. As it stands, it's a managed residential service with poor management. I'd rather do it myself.
 
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Just a bump here as I think this is relevant to the conversation.


I think there's a fine line here. Yes, you're correct in that the ONT itself is the dmarc; fiber side is the provider and copper side is the user. However, when you run into issues like "what lights are on the unit?" No. Log into it and you tell me. If I'm physically required to assist in troubleshooting, then realistically the dmarc moves back a bit.

You could take that view, but if the ONT is disconnected from the PON network at a management layer it might be sensible for the end user to confirm what flashy lights are on the unit. After all it's hardly going to be cost effective for the supplier to provide their own out of band access to the ONT for very infrequent troubleshooting on a domestic service that has a low SLA which can pragmatically be replaced with the customer confirming if a couple of LEDs are lit, flashing or not.

I have had commercial ISPs expecting me to confirm the status of LEDs of big£ circuits before they wanted to consider any engineers being sent out. YMMV.
 
You may potentially cause problems on the split if there is a incompatibility, I dont recommend it.

Also the ONT as far as I know for both Cityfibre and Openreach is a standalone device converting to ethernet already.

I use my own device connected to the ONT via ethernet.
 
You could take that view, but if the ONT is disconnected from the PON network at a management layer it might be sensible for the end user to confirm what flashy lights are on the unit. After all it's hardly going to be cost effective for the supplier to provide their own out of band access to the ONT for very infrequent troubleshooting on a domestic service that has a low SLA which can pragmatically be replaced with the customer confirming if a couple of LEDs are lit, flashing or not.

I have had commercial ISPs expecting me to confirm the status of LEDs of big£ circuits before they wanted to consider any engineers being sent out. YMMV.
Likewise, the essential lack of an SLA could be enhanced by my own ability to better monitor said device. I pay for the service, and replacing something they could do with me into the troubleshooting chain isn't something I'd like to continue to do when there are better options. As mentioned, if I'm remote, checking the lights is a non starter. While I appreciate that a loss of service would negate any ability I had when remote at that point, the point there is I'd have better visibility into the event after the fact.

Case in point, the outage I recently had was met with "no one else called." So it's no one's fault. There was no outage. There is nothing anyone can do. That's not even a low SLA...that's no SLA.
 
Agree, but also note that most domestic ISPs do not claim to include remote monitoring of your service, whereas in the commercial world you will typically get an email or SMS within half and hour or so to say "we noticed your circuit went down/can't see your NTE, have you lost power or is there a fault we need to act on, if so call/click/etc."

Customers who pay for circuits are typically not causing them to go down randomly, or have UPS protection so their ISPs will build in automation to assess possible outages and act accordingly.

Domestic consumers are just too random, they'll unplug the ONT to plug in the vacuum and ISPs monitoring would constantly look like a Christmas tree of alarms.

Many on this forum are definitely more prosumers rather than consumers of connectivity but unfortunately there's no easy way of getting consumer ISPs clued up to give us 0.5% of the population a separate service level. The best we have are outfits like Aquiss and A&A, but even they don't operate at the Infra layer so can't unbundle the standard ONT offering.
 
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Just a little bump here.

I've been offered, and gladly accepted, an ISP provided SFP ONT, in this case the Adtran SDX630. It operates perfectly fine in, at the moment, a Unifi US-XG-6PoE. While at present I don't have any access to its UI, I at least can see light levels, and from a monitoring perspective, have more direct insight into the service's status.
 
Just a little bump here.

I've been offered, and gladly accepted, an ISP provided SFP ONT, in this case the Adtran SDX630. It operates perfectly fine in, at the moment, a Unifi US-XG-6PoE. While at present I don't have any access to its UI, I at least can see light levels, and from a monitoring perspective, have more direct insight into the service's status.
Nice which ISP are you with?
 
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