Home
 » ISP News » 
Sponsored

UPD ASA Ban BT Broadband Checker for Misleading FTTC Availability Claims

Wednesday, January 9th, 2013 (7:50 am) - Score 1,803

The UK Advertising Standards Authority (ASA) has upheld fifteen complainants against BT’s website based broadband availability checker service because it often delivered unreliable “provisional” coverage dates for their UK superfast BTInfinity (FTTC) service and was thus deemed “likely to mislead“.

BTOpenreach, which manages access to the operators national UK telecoms network, has always advised that the dates it sets for local superfast broadband (FTTC/P) availability are provisional and thus open to change (i.e. it’s not uncommon for some upgrades to face delays of up to and beyond 6 months).

Unfortunately BT Retail’s own web-based availability checker didn’t always make this clear and the ISP states that it only moved to make “significant changes to the wording on the Infinity checker” on 16th October 2012. The ASA also noted that one complainant had been informed by BT on 17th October 2012 that plans for the FTTC roll-out in his area had been put on hold.

ASA Assessment (Complaint Ref: A12-209611)

We considered that the appearance of a date or provisional date in the availability checker suggested that active plans were in place to roll out BT Infinity in that area and that the service would therefore be available on or around that time, and the listed date should not be subsequently or regularly pushed back. We noted we had not seen supporting documentation showing that, in each of the areas where the complainants were based, the listed date in the availability checker was based on scheduled plans for Openreach to have BT Infinity available in those areas on or around the listed dates.

We considered that the date BT Infinity was expected to be available in their area would be a material consideration for consumers when deciding whether to register an interest in the service. Because we had not seen documentation that showed there were scheduled plans to roll out BT Infinity in the complainants’ areas and make BT Infinity available in those areas on or around the listed dates, and because we understood that, in at least one case, there were currently no plans for BT Infinity to be rolled out in an area while the availability checker listed a provisional date that was less than three months away, we considered that the inclusion of provisional dates was likely to mislead.

The issue of predicted FTTC availability dates has been a hot one for BT and more than a few people have complained about lengthy delays. But perhaps ironically BT’s overall roll-out is still expected to complete 18 months earlier than originally planned (i.e. completed by spring 2014).

Never the less the ASA told BT that in future its availability checker cannot be used unless they “ensure that [it] only included dates if they corresponded to scheduled plans for Openreach to engineer the BT Infinity service to the corresponding area“, which could also impact similar availability tests by other ISPs.

BT said that they were already working with Openreach on the development of a new superfast online checker, while their existing availability checker was set to be “significantly amended” in early 2013. In the meantime BT reminded that Openreach has a tool on its site that allows customers to enter their postcode and obtain “up-to-date information about the status of their local exchange and their local cabinet“.

Separately Virgin Media escaped the ASA ban hammer after Sky Broadband and another member of the public complained that their “up to” speeds were misleading “because they understood that customers received speeds significantly lower than the stated maximum speeds” (partly due to the impact of Virgin’s Traffic Management policy). The ASA ruled that this was not misleading.

UPDATE 1:07pm

BT Retail has chimed in with an official statement.

A BT Spokeswoman told ISPreview.co.uk:

This is a disappointing ruling. People clearly want to know when fibre might become available in their area and so BT has been publishing its best estimates on a regular basis. Those plans sometimes have to change however if local planning permission isn’t granted or we find that a third party can’t meet our deadlines.

15 complaints is a tiny number when you consider that BT is enabling tens of thousands of cabinets but we will work with the ASA to make changes where we can as it is clear that people remain keen to know when fibre might reach them.”

Share with Twitter
Share with Linkedin
Share with Facebook
Share with Reddit
Share with Pinterest
By Mark Jackson
Mark is a professional technology writer, IT consultant and computer engineer from Dorset (England), he also founded ISPreview in 1999 and enjoys analysing the latest telecoms and broadband developments. Find me on Twitter, , Facebook and Linkedin.
Leave a Comment
62 Responses
  1. Bob says:

    Quite how they got away with it for so long is a mystery. OFCOM should also have stepped in to stop BT posting totally meaning less dates. If you pu give a date it has to be realistic that you expect to achieve

  2. Bob says:

    It is irrelevcent to state they are subject to change, Quite clearly very many were not real dates at all as they would move several quarters.

    If a date is given it has to be a realistic date and clearly BT are not giving realistic dates at all. If you take the original list of exchnges they PLANNED to complete by Decembere only a 104 of the 194 weere completed. Only just over 50% of them. In reality the BT dates were just fiction.

  3. Jim says:

    The date for my FTTC has slipped 6 times and is now 21 months after the original estimated date from BT.

    1. Sledgehammer says:

      Will this mean that the roll out will now take us into 2016?

    2. Anon says:

      My date was revised several times too. Was due to get FTTC in August/Sept 2012, actually got it in January 2012 (cabinet installed in November) so a few months before schedule.

    3. Stoat says:

      Ditto.

      In my opinon the continually slipping dates are to discourage customers from jumping ship to other services.

  4. Bob says:

    What it means is BT will have to publish realistic date they expect to meet. Based on exchanges they have currently listed as getting FTTC/P they are only achieving about 50% of them on the current progress over the last 18 months/ That means they wil complete the current list about 12 months late

    1. DTMark says:

      Isn’t “exchanges enabled” a rather meaningless target, because in theory one cabinet enabled on an exchange = exchange enabled, and only BT know which cabinets were targeted originally anyway.

    2. Bob says:

      It is but the only real information BT release is at the exchange level. When it comes to cabinets it is a black art other than if the exchange is already enabbled

      It should not be difficult for BT to include in the BT OPenreach checker information on the Cabinet Status so if you put a phone number of full postcode and house number it gives you proper information ie

      ENABLED

      ESTIMATED AVAILABLE End of MARCH

      COMMING SOON Estimate End of Q2 2013

      PLANNED for 2014

      NOT IN COMMERCIAL ROLLOUT

      EO Line Not Currently Available

    3. Kyle says:

      From my grasp of what happened in our village, the exchange was enabled before any cabinets were installed (of which there are 4).

      In that case, it was a case of ‘exchange enabled’ before a single subscriber could join the service!

  5. Phil says:

    No wonder we all hate BT – they always left us in the dark. My friend is furious and agry with BT because BT told him that FTTC is available at his exchange, so he placed an order, BT engineer come to his property in three weeks later and activated his broadband and only to find out that he only enabled 21CN ADSL2+ (no FTTC) and he complaint to BT and BT had informed and regret that his exchange does have FTTC enabled but his street and his property are no longer FTTC available and he want to cancel ADSL2+ but BT told him it far too late to cancel or face penalty charge for the remaining 18 months contract.

    1. DTMark says:

      “BT told him that FTTC is available at his exchange, so he placed an order”

      For the FTTC service?

      “BT told him it far too late to cancel or face penalty charge for the remaining 18 months contract”

      If the order was for ADSL2+ with the customer able to upgrade “when FTTC available” it’s a bit different. In that case, the customer knowingly ordered ADSL2+ which has been supplied.

      If the order was for FTTC, the contract has not been fulfilled, so either BT supply what was ordered, or refund and compensate him.

      If it was a new order for a new line + FTTC, then the customer should expect a complete refund and full cancellation of all services.

      If it was a migrate to BT then they will probably have two separate contracts, one for the line rental and one for the broadband which complicates matters a little.

      Essentially, if the contract were formed on the basis of a FTTC service being supplied, as opposed to “*should* be available at some point in the future” then BT have breached the contract and so should put the customer back in the position they were in before. What does the order confirmation say?

      Is there a get-out in the Ts and Cs which says something like “if FTTC isn’t available we will provision ADSL2+” instead? If so, and that’s not brought to the attention of the customer, then the Ts and Cs are, I’d suggest, unlawful.

      Of course all of this depends on there being an alternative available, such as 3G/4G/cable. If there is no alternative service then the customer is stuck with ADSL2+ though may consider whether they wish to continue with BT on that, or take it from someone else.

      That’s my take anyway.

    2. Anoyed tax payer says:

      @Phil, did your friend not understand, that FTTC is from the cabinet and not from the exchange?

  6. Bob says:

    THe BT information is shambolic and confusing.THe BT Openreaach Web site checker basically just gives information on when an Exchange is enabled. Some times on a fairlly ad hoc basis it may give information about a cabinet. The dates on the PDF 0r Ecel documents on their Web Site should be taken with a very lrge pinch of salt they are not proper schedule dates at all. It basically means that the date shown is a list of exhanges that if they get around to it may or may not be enabled in that time scale. If they do not achieve it they move it out 3 months and it may or may not be enabled in the next quarter

    Information with regard to cabinets is even more scant. If you can actualy get it it is usualy clear but if it is not it may or may not show a date. Thise dates are also usualy pretty meaningless

    BT complain about poor take up but it is a nightmare to find any accurate information. THey dont even do mail shots when exchanges and cabinets go live. It woulkd seem a sensible thing to do. Such mailshots typically get a 2% to 5% response rate

    1. FibreFred says:

      Who doesn’t do mailshots Bob? BT Openreach or the ISP’s?

      All Openreach do is tell the ISP’s the exchange/cab is ready is up to the ISP’s to mailshot and tout their wares

  7. FibreFred says:

    Oh well the answer surely is not to bother publishing any dates at all then? Just leave the customer to keep checking when they can be bothered instead of checking around a rough date?

    1. DTMark says:

      So far as BT’s commercial rollout is concerned, then BT can take as long as they want, and publish as much or as little information as they want, as is their right. As you imply, they could simply provide less information in the first place. Then there’s less to criticise.

      Where this matters, is where a purchasing decision is made on the basis of the information supplied, and in particular if someone is given an expected date of availability it might be acceptable for it to slip a little, but I don’t think it’s then acceptable that somebody might make a concious decision to go with BT on the basis of projected availability and then be told that not only is it “late”, but it might not be coming at all.

      I’ve even seen one or two threads where people have made a decision about moving home on the basis of projected availability only to move in and find the date has mysteriously “vanished”.

      Wouldn’t matter so much if there were competition and alternatives.

    2. FibreFred says:

      When you say go with BT you FTTC via BT, or Sky, or TT etc etc? Not just “Infinity” sure I agree with that.

      If someone is holding out thinking they could get FTTC instead of say Virgin then I can see why this could be damaging. But I stand by what I say really, if it could be misleading and people are planning around these dates, don’t put them up, BT Openreach included, just advertise them as available when the cab is available for use

    3. DTMark says:

      The issue appears to be with sales e.g. at a retail level. Regardless of which provider, if when you look to sign up you’re told there’s a chance you can get FTTC but it’s not certain then fair enough. Customer has been given no commitment whatsoever.

      If an over-eager sales person or the BT Infinity (in this case, the cited example) checker said instead that you *would* be able to get it, then that’s different. It all appears to be in the detail of the wording.

    4. FibreFred says:

      Sure but everyone’s checker is based on Openreach data surely?

    5. DTMark says:

      It’s poor form to blame the supplier in front of the customer.

      If ISPs choose Openreach to supply their services and are let down, thus letting their customers down then the onus is on the ISP to make things right and compensate the customer.

      The ISP is contracted by the customer, not Openreach.

      If the ISPs don’t like that they can always use a different supplier.

      Oh, wait, they can’t. Makes no difference to the position though.

  8. Bob says:

    THe issue has been one of BT not providing proper dates. I have the Full ASA report as I was onme of the complainants

    BT have in effect been putting random dates against exchanges ie they will come up with a list of 190 odd excchanges and put the End of March say against them. THese have not been real dates and only about 50% typically get enabled. BT then just move the one they did not get around to out by 3 months

    BT have now been told any dates they put have to be accurate estimates based on the project plans. The ASA expects that BT should be delivering most of the exchanges with dates only 3 months out to the given date, It accepts in some circumstances delays can occur and when this happens a proper revised date should be given ie not just move it out a quarter

    The complaint was not against BT retail. It was against BT Telecomunications plc and mainly related to data on its various web sites

    1. FibreFred says:

      How do you know they are random dates?

    2. Stoat says:

      Slightly related, BTOR’s website has a number of areas where an exchange is “enabled” (Mine has been since september) but there are no working cabinets to connect to.

      This is misleading too.

      _IF_ my cabinet goes live on 31st march, it will be slightly over 2 years since they promised it (and gave me an installation appointment). The local BTOR guys say the given date is as ficticious as any previously seen.

  9. DummySpitter says:

    ….. http://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2012/06/bt-list-next-93-uk-locations-superfast-broadband-deployment.html#comment-9892

    You don’t need to say anything further to the BT employee Bob, YOU WIN

    ….. http://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2012/07/sky-uk-make-76mb-superfast-broadband-fibre-pro-service-available-to-all.html#comment-10406

    Looks like their blub about 330Mbps availability will be on some peoples agenda next.

    Or as the BT employee says… A “PRICELESS” decision by the ASA over “NO ADVERT”.

    Maybe he will comprehend now its not just advertising in the sense he thinks the ASA have powers over. Also the Virgin decision, i bet when they read that bit it was like pouring petrol on a flame.

    1. FibreFred says:

      Lol here comes Deduction/Michael/etc with yet another alias, don’t you ever get bored?

    2. Bob says:

      Think Broadband which appear to be another sitr sponsered by BT is busy trying to spit it claiming the ruling was against BT and an advert. Both are incorrect

      It mainly impacted the BT openreach web site and inpartiular dates ggiven but as it has links to various other BT sites the ruling was against BT Telecomunicaions plc. THere was no advert involved. Many people automaticaly assume that with the ASA iy has to be an advert. This used to be the case but no longer applies

      BT tried to get themselves off the hook with a blanket disclaimer that said dates may moved. THat does not work though. A disclaimer can be applied saying dates may move but the dates have to be realistic in the first place and the date move resonable i a fews weeks at most, You canot put 31st March 2011 and then deliver it in September 2012

  10. Deduction says:

    As i have had to tell you before i do not need multiple IDs unlike yourself. Whoever that user is they have pointed out a common occurrence on this site.
    That being YOU = FAIL… AGAIN
    Just waiting for BT to claim nonsense 120Mb and 300+Mb availability nationwide on their checker now and like bob ill be filing my complaint with the ASA about the idiot organisation you work for.
    As to getting bored. I suggest you jog on and moan about Virgin to the ASA again. I assume that is you as you are always moaning about them. 5 out of the last 8 complaints to the ASA about Virgin have been from a SINGLE member of the public. You seem to fit that mould.

    BOTTOM LINE IS WE ALL NOW KNOW WHAT HAS BEEN KNOWN FOR AGES AND WHAT YOU DENY…… BTS AVAILABILITY FIGURES FOR WHO CAN HAVE FTTC ARE COMPLETE BS.

    You may now engage rage response. The only one that looks an idiot (AGAIN) is you. Congrats on that LOL

  11. zemadeiran says:

    This is one rough conversation…

  12. dragoneast says:

    BT’s been told to raise its game, quite rightly. But all the hullabaloo . . . modern life is complex and when every business is trying to do more with less, mistakes will happen, even of the “concious” variety. I don’t think anybody dies or starves through waiting for faster broadband, as happens with other services. And anyone who lives out their life believing everyone’s promises, is either a saint or a fool. Open your eyes, if you don’t see a cab it ain’t coming in less than 3 months; and if you can predict the future three months ahead then you should be an astrologer. Competition and regulation are a messy mix, however you play it; but that’s the route we chose and we have to live with it. Other countries play it differently, and did a better job in my view: as ever good ‘ole UK wanted the “kiss me quick” cash we made from privatisation in preference to longer-term investment, so in our muddle-and-make-do culture everyone is just about doing the best job they can. And everyone bitches, as usual. Calm down dears . . . please.

    1. Stoat says:

      Even if you do see a cab. that’s no guarantee either. The one 10 metres from my house was stood up in early September, but there’s no way it’ll be live before the March 31 deadline.

  13. Michael says:

    This is the second time i have been accused of being an individual that posted above. I find it quite amusing, a total flight of fantasy though, a bit like BT availability figures. Is it standard practice to just make wild accusations on this site?

    Nice work by the ASA though. We can now all pretty much ignore anything BT and its supporters have to say about roll out dates and ‘percents’ on FTTC availability, its all wishful thinking at best and out right lies at worse. The readers of this site with any molecule of common sense knew it already though.

    To be a little bit fair to BT. Perhaps BT just do not know the actual availability in any detail and that is why they have been making it up as they go along with figures they ‘thought’ sounded possible.

    1. FibreFred says:

      Its the third isn’t it? Mark told you as well? There’s only one troll on this site but under many totally transparent guises

  14. Bob says:

    Let’s clarify this. It is a test of reasonableness. The ASA and the complaints were not expecting BT to deliver 100% to the schedule but they were expecting BT particularly when dates are only 3 months out to be finished on or about the given date in most cases. When BT as they did published lists of exchanges and gives then a date 3 months out and then only delivers less than 50% of them, then clearly those dates are not real. It is even more of a giveaway when BT moves them all out en-bloc 3 months.
    Evidence was supplied to the ASA that this was happening several times in many cases i.e. the date going from 3 month to 18 months and these were not isolated examples
    BT if they give dates will now be required to give realistic dates and if a date moves it must give a new revised date and not just move it 3 months. If BT cannot estimated fairly accurately completion dates only 3 months away they have a major problem

    1. FibreFred says:

      Or Bob the easiest option as I say.. don’t publish any until the exchange/cab is live. Massive headache gone in an instant

  15. fastman says:

    the major problem is cabs in delay due to planning or siting or objections that are on enabled exchanges are usually caught in this – will be intereting to see what happends to those — i assume these will move to no date (until resolved) – i have seem some outstanding for 12 – 15 months in some cases

    1. Bob says:

      Cabinet delays are rare. Most are not subject to planning permision. There have been some problems in conservation areas but you are looking at less than 1% of cabinets. If a cabinet is in a conservation area then it would be sensible to informally approach the councils with the proposed location during the early planning stage and before setting a date for the cabinet always rembering to build in the time for formal planning permision. In the past BT have not
      Even if planning permision is not required it is always best to run it past the council as they can still object on road safety grounds and obstruction grounds and due to tree preservation orders

    2. FibreFred says:

      More twaddle the requirement for planning permission isn’t the only reason for a delay in a cab, take your pick of many reasons

    3. Stoat says:

      Not true.

      Surrey has been fast-tracking every single application BT have put in and they’re still over 2 years late.

      The vast majority of cabinets don’t require planning permission – this is only a requirement in conservation areas, which is a shame because tracking planning permission might be a way of looking for possible rollout dates.

      The local BT guys have commented a few times about being pulled from working on stuff around here to “all hands” rollouts in areas where they need to gazump a competitor’s rollout.

  16. Michael says:

    The only twaddle i see is BTs availability claims.

    Quite humorous that you have resorted to accusing people of being trolls and stating others speak twaddle. What a funny chap you are.

    The funniest thing though, is no matter how angry you get it wont alter the fact BT lied about availability and now they have been found out.

    Seems everyone in this news items comments agrees BT have been caught with their pants down, and the goods now on show are not as large as they wanted people to believe. 😀 Good job they have a big E-penis supporting them instead 😉

    1. Gadget says:

      Why are the availability claims twaddle? Knowing the coverage connected to a cabinet being enabled, and knowledge of which cabinets are enabled should enable a simple calculation. Granted the cabinets may not have been the ones originally intended at that time the cabinet x coverage calculation must be easy to do and I would expect both City analysts and ISP customers to be shouting if the numbers do not stack up.

  17. John says:

    About time BT and their twaddle claims on availability were taken to task. Well played to the ASA.

  18. Darren says:

    ensure that [it] only included dates if they corresponded to scheduled plans for Openreach to engineer the BT Infinity FTTC service to the corresponding area

    Fixed it for the ASA.

    How about people who are told FTTC isn’t available when it is, like when talk talk told a mate it wasn’t, then offered him a new router for free and of course that signed him up to a new contract. So when I told him it was actually available he coudn’t move because they had locked him in. That’s right, talk talk would rather lock you in for another 12 months on ADSL at 2Mb than lose you to an ISP that is capable of providing FTTC at 76Mb. Nice one talk talk.

    That’s just as bad as telling people it’s available when it’s not.

    1. DTMark says:

      This scenario is possible, in that BT may be able to provide FTTC but Talk Talk and Sky cannot, because they have not installed the interconnect needed between the cabinet handover and their network (approach is called GEA).

      I imagine Talk Talk would rather sell ADSL than FTTC in common with most providers, as it makes more money.

    2. Darren says:

      Yeah I’m aware of that, it doesn’t excuse it though. At the end of the day it’s just business but it’s just as bad as what BT have been repramanded for here, yet talktalk get away with it.

  19. FibreFred says:

    So is this ruling saying:-

    1) BT Retail (selling Infinity) are telling customers Infinity is available when it isn’t and this clashes with info from Openreach
    2) No other ISP’s are doing 1)

    I’m just not clear on where the problem is here, the info comes from Openreach so is the Openreach info wrong (which surely affects all ISP’s and their checkers?) or are BT just ignoring that anyway and saying its available where it doesn’t exist, if so how does their checker differ to says Plunets, Skys and TalkTalk?

    1. DTMark says:

      As I read it

      (1) Yes, but it doesn’t clash with the information provided, it was on the basis of the information provided which was subsequently changed

      (2) It doesn’t say that, other ISPs could be culpable also

      Example of Wholesale checker result

      Your cabinet is planned to have WBC FTTC by 31st March 2013. Our test also indicates that your line currently supports a fibre technology with an estimated WBC FTTC Broadband where consumers have received downstream line speed of 72.3 Mbps and upstream line speed of 20 Mbps.

      “Planned to have” – in some cases, the plan mysteriously vanished.

      The above is grammatical nonsense anyway and doesn’t actually make sense. It mixes future and present tenses. I wonder if this has something to do with it.

      “Planned to have” could instead read “may have”.

      Talk Talk and Sky may be less susceptible to this, because in addition to the cabinet needing installation, their GEA kit also needs installation. If the latter isn’t present, then when the cabinet is enabled is not relevant.

    2. FibreFred says:

      So if BT stopped using their checker (they haven’t) how does that solve the problem, if the info is from Openreach and its subject to change then this same issues will affect other ISP’s and advertising also (GEA taken into consideration)

  20. Michael says:

    @BOB and NICKCWATTS (if the read this site also)…
    ———————

    As you were 2 of the original complainants to BT and the adjudication is against BRITISH TELECOMMUNICATIONS PLC it may be worth you re-notifying the ASA that they are still potentially quoting false dates in information such as this…

    https://www.btwholesale.com/shared/document/Library/Network_Information/21CN_Broadband_Availibility/WBC_SFBB_Dataset_20121203.xls

    Even more so if that list has either of your exchanges listed with a date which has been altered on more than one occasion. The original complaint which was UPHELD after all was “….misleading, because they had noted, on visiting the website again, that the date had been pushed back, in some instances, repeatedly, over a long period.”

    If they are still doing that via other means apart from the checker im sure the ASA would like to hear from you again and get information like that removed also 🙂

    1. Somerset says:

      Likely that will disappear behind a login for Wholesale customers?

    2. Stoat says:

      That spreadsheet shows exchanges, not cabinets.

      My town has had an enabled exchange since September but I’ve yet to find a postcode within it where BT retail/plusnet/talktalk say that FTTC is available _now_

    3. Stoat says:

      Also worth noting (as I have) that BTOR are marking exchanges as enabled (which simply means the gear at the exchamge end is installed), but it’s still impossible to buy service as there are no working FTTC cabinets.

  21. Michael says:

    Possibly Somerset, it would be the sensible thing for them to do. Does not look like they will be doing so though, this is also listed on the wholesale site…

    https://www.btwholesale.com/shared/document/Library/Network_Information/21CN_Broadband_Availibility/WBC_SFBB_Dataset_20130104.xls

    Assuming those last few figures in the link are the date that is an upto date list as of about a week ago, again with pie in the sky (as we can now call it 😉 ) future dates. Accessed from this page https://www.btwholesale.com/pages/static/Library/Network_Information/21CN_Broadband_Availibility/index.htm
    and the “click here to download link” at the bottom.

    Interestingly if you click “21CN Service Availability and Network Inventory” link to the left of that same page that one does require you login… Maybe they have missed locking bits down 😉 ?

    Id also suggest to those that complained they keep an eye on this list also…

    http://www.openreach.co.uk/orpg/home/products/super-fastfibreaccess/downloads/sffa_exchange_lists/coming_soon.pdf

    For any dates which slip.

    For the most part that is a copy of the wholesale info but unless my eyes deceived me when i looked that also has the odd contradictory date to the wholesale info. OPPS!

    Does anyone know if there is a time frame in which organisations have to comply with ASA decisions? It will be interesting as BRITISH TELECOMMUNICATIONS PLC have numerous websites with so called “future” dates.

    1. Somerset says:

      Note new text:

      The indicative dates are estimates only and may change.
      Please contact your Communications Provider for information on when they expect to provide services in your area.

  22. Michael says:

    That text is not new though Somerset from what i can tell. BT have always stated dates are “estimates” as demonstrated in the first wholesale link i provided dating back to 2012.12.03. Even if it were new the latest wholesale link provided has a date of 2013.01.04 the ASA decision though was on the 9th Jan this year (IE after). So they were saying dates were “estimates” before then and it did not help their case.

    I think you will find that text or words to that effect was also on the old PDF version only instead of being at the top it was at the bottom and in smaller print. I agree though (maybe coincidence) that pdf link was updated on the 9th also.

    Either way the ASA adjudication is clear and rightly or wrongly they feel “provisional” dates are misleading.

  23. Stoat says:

    Has anyone else noticed that the BBC, Guardian and other main media are studiously ignoring the adjudication?

  24. Bob says:

    BT cannot hide behind indicative dates. If they give a date it has to be the Planned date now, If they fail to meet the planned date then the date can be moved but again it has to be a revised plan date not just 3 months out

    Some posters her possibly who work for BT seem to think this is unreasonable and think it is way beyond BT’s capability to accurately plan a 3 months job and don’t think it unreasonable that 3 months can become 18 months

    When BT issues quarterly list of Exchanges with typically a 195 exchanges on them for completion within 3 months and it regularly only delivers fewer than 50% of them there is a problem
    One has to wonder exactly how BT costs these tasks if it has not a clue as to how long it will take.
    Other problems seem to be poor advance planning by BT. They have often failed to build in time for obtaining planning permission and power installation
    If BT publish a list of exchanges as being enabled within a quarter it is not unreasonable to expect at least 90% to be completed to that timescales with the other 10% being pushed out a few weeks
    Exceptionally a few may get pushed out further you to considerable unforeseen issues. There though would be very isolated instances which could be due to poor records (Some line plant is 50 years plus old ) So they may find they need a way leaf agreement etc
    Hopefully BT will now publish realistic dates for both the Exchanges and Cabinets

    1. Somerset says:

      …or only publish details when an exchange is enabled.

    1. Stoat says:

      Complete with ficitious install-by dates.

    2. Somerset says:

      Would you prefer no dates?

  25. Michael says:

    Great link Somerset for those wanting to check if they are connected to a cabinet with Fibre services. Probably the best ive seen for that info.

    The only problem is the ADSL2/+ results seem to be a bit confusing. Feed it my details for example and as a snippet for ADSL2+ results i get….

    Avail. Prod…. Downstream Line Rate… Rate Downstream Range
    ADSL 2+…….. Up to 17…………… 10 to 19.5
    ADSL 2+ Annex M Up to 17…………… 10 to 19.5

    So they think i will get the same down rate on ADSL2+ as i will on ADSL2+ Annex M (LOL i dont think so) and although BT RETAIL ADSL2+ products are UPTO 16Mb the BT wholesale checker seems to think its UPTO 17Mb and im gonna get something in the range of 10-19.5Mb

    Or short version….. More fubar figures from em 😉

    Again though good link for people to check if they can get FTTC 🙂

Comments are closed.

Comments RSS Feed

Javascript must be enabled to post (most browsers do this automatically)

Privacy Notice: Please note that news comments are anonymous, which means that we do NOT require you to enter any real personal details to post a message. By clicking to submit a post you agree to storing your comment content, display name, IP, email and / or website details in our database, for as long as the post remains live.

Only the submitted name and comment will be displayed in public, while the rest will be kept private (we will never share this outside of ISPreview, regardless of whether the data is real or fake). This comment system uses submitted IP, email and website address data to spot abuse and spammers. All data is transferred via an encrypted (https secure) session.

NOTE 1: Sometimes your comment might not appear immediately due to site cache (this is cleared every few hours) or it may be caught by automated moderation / anti-spam.

NOTE 2: Comments that break our rules, spam, troll or post via known fake IP/proxy servers may be blocked or removed.
Cheapest Superfast ISPs
  • Hyperoptic £15.00 (*25.00)
    Speed 50Mbps, Unlimited
    Gift: None
  • Vodafone £19.50 (*22.50)
    Speed 35Mbps, Unlimited
    Gift: None
  • NOW £20.00 (*32.00)
    Speed 36Mbps, Unlimited
    Gift: None
  • Shell Energy £21.99 (*30.99)
    Speed 35Mbps, Unlimited
    Gift: None
  • Plusnet £22.99 (*38.20)
    Speed 36Mbps, Unlimited
    Gift: £70 Reward Card
Large Availability | View All
Cheapest Ultrafast ISPs
  • Hyperoptic £20.00 (*35.00)
    Speed: 150Mbps, Unlimited
    Gift: None
  • Vodafone £24.00 (*27.00)
    Speed: 100Mbps, Unlimited
    Gift: None
  • Community Fibre £25.00 (*29.50)
    Speed: 300Mbps, Unlimited
    Gift: None
  • Gigaclear £27.00 (*59.00)
    Speed: 500Mbps, Unlimited
    Gift: None
  • Virgin Media £27.00 (*51.00)
    Speed: 108Mbps, Unlimited
    Gift: None
Large Availability | View All
The Top 20 Category Tags
  1. FTTP (3506)
  2. BT (3010)
  3. Politics (1925)
  4. Building Digital UK (1919)
  5. FTTC (1882)
  6. Openreach (1822)
  7. Business (1680)
  8. Mobile Broadband (1469)
  9. Statistics (1406)
  10. FTTH (1364)
  11. 4G (1271)
  12. Fibre Optic (1167)
  13. Virgin Media (1159)
  14. Wireless Internet (1153)
  15. Ofcom Regulation (1140)
  16. Vodafone (836)
  17. EE (830)
  18. TalkTalk (761)
  19. 5G (760)
  20. Sky Broadband (744)
Promotion
Helpful ISP Guides and Tips
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
»
Sponsored

Copyright © 1999 to Present - ISPreview.co.uk - All Rights Reserved - Terms , Privacy and Cookie Policy , Links , Website Rules , Contact