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Cable ISP Virgin Media Start UK Customer Trial of IPv6 Addresses

Thursday, June 7th, 2018 (5:18 pm) - Score 13,738
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Cable broadband and TV operator Virgin Media has this week begun sending out “confidential” invites to what appears to be their first official customer trial of the IPv6 internet addressing standard, which until now has only been tested internally by the company’s staff (plus the occasional unexpected subscriber).

The trial itself is expected to last for 4 weeks and, as previously reported on ISPreview.co.uk (full details), it will harness the recently purchased Benu Networks’ IPv6 Dual-Stack (DS-Lite) solution in order to “provide a seamless migration to IPv6 in the UK“. This is being conducted alongside ARRIS, which of course makes Virgin Media’s Hub 3.0 (TG2492S/CE) router (no prizes for guessing that this trial is only for Hub 3.0 users).

On top of that there will be a few other caveats for those who join the new community trial. Firstly, modem mode will need to be disabled on your Hub 3.0. Secondly, Virgin’s Web Safe internet filter (Parental Controls) must also be switched off (we assume this won’t be necessary once the final solution is deployed) and the operator has warned that some native IPv4 kit may not work (well it is a trial, so expect bugs).

Expert users may also be nervous about Virgin Media’s decision to go with DS-Lite for their IPv6 solution, not least because it could involve some Carrier Grade NAT (CGNAT) being used on older IPv4 internet addresses (i.e. IP address sharing). A good implementation of CGNAT will work for the vast majority of internet services but there could still be a few connectivity problems for certain apps (home servers, VPN, VoIP, online games etc.).

At this stage it’s just a short trial and the feedback might yet impact the operator’s plan for a national rollout. As usual we’ll be keeping a close eye on this, just as we did with BT and Sky Broadband’s own deployments of IPv6 sometime ago. Last week we also asked TalkTalk whether they had established a plan or timescale for IPv6 deployment but they gave us the cold shoulder, again.

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Mark Jackson
By Mark Jackson
Mark is a professional technology writer, IT consultant and computer engineer from Dorset (England), he is also the founder of ISPreview since 1999 and enjoys analysing the latest telecoms and broadband developments. Find me on Twitter, , Facebook and Linkedin.
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43 Responses
  1. Ross

    DS-lite is a massive mistake.

    • Spurple

      Yea I don’t understand why they can’t simply serve both v4 and v6 addresses and let endpoints and services decide what to use.

    • Chris P

      me neither,

      looks like cable can dual stack,

      https://volpefirm.com/ipv6/

      there must be some advantage for vm to do CGNAT. It’ll break my use of VM BB so i hope there is a faster BT BB available for me when they go native.

    • un4h731x0rp3r0m

      The news item says only that “it could involve” CGNAT. That has not been decided.

  2. Rich

    I don’t want DS-Lite. I would rather stay IPv4 only.

    If they try to force me to go on to DS-Lite I will move ISPs.

  3. Markus

    Most sites I really care about already have IPv6 today, so I don’t mind that much about DS-Lite, i.e. sharing my IPv4 address with others. I’d rather move to IPv6-only as fast as possible. But not having modem mode is slightly disappointing. Well, my main reason for having my own OpenWRT NAT router was that VM’s NAT timed out so quickly that ssh was useless. With IPv6, I hopefully soon won’t care much about NAT any more at all.

    • JustAnotherFileServer

      So you don’t mind getting prosecuted because someone else using the same IP address has been using their internet connection for illegal means. Oh okay.

    • Gareth

      @JustAnotherFileServer You’re barking up the wrong tree there. VM will likely be using some form of netflow accounting that will be perfectly capable of identifying which connections belong to individual customers behind their CGNAT.

      Of course if they weren’t using some form of connection accounting, they wouldn’t be able to identify connections through their CGNAT so there wouldn’t be enough information to identify you in a prosecution. Either way you don’t need to worry about it.

    • JustAnotherFileServer

      @Gareth Where other ISP’s has used CGNAT it hasn’t stopped websites blocking people because other people using the IP address has abused the website in someway. It still has the onus on the individual to get the issue resolved.

      A website will only know the IP address (yes the ISP might know the individual customer, but that might not come out until the authorities have been involved). There has already been cases of this where ISPs have used this sort of system.

    • un4h731x0rp3r0m

      “So you don’t mind getting prosecuted because someone else using the same IP address has been using their internet connection for illegal means. Oh okay.”

      Nonsense, the ISP each time an addres is allocated know exactly which person or persons it has been allocated to

    • JustAnotherFileServer

      @un4h731x0rp3r0m I see you didn’t bother reading either the article or the comments, instead you did what you normally do and troll under your different name.

      If you had read anything you would know that they will be using CGNAT (which as far as a website is concerned it will not know who from the 500 odd people using the same IP address is doing what). Therefore if someone is lets say posting abusive messages on a website they will ban that IP address and therefore all the people who are sharing that IP address will not be able to access that website.

    • CarlT

      ‘JustAnotherFileServer
      June 8, 2018 at 11:55 am

      So you don’t mind getting prosecuted because someone else using the same IP address has been using their internet connection for illegal means.

      JustAnotherFileServer
      June 8, 2018 at 1:01 pm

      A website will only know the IP address (yes the ISP might know the individual customer, but that might not come out until the authorities have been involved). There has already been cases of this where ISPs have used this sort of system.’

      Okay. How exactly do you propose the authorities prosecute someone without a court order served to the ISP to obtain details on who was using that particular connection at the time?

      Unless there was something in crime that gave the person’s identity away, which rather makes CG-NAT irrelevant, how are the authorities going to blame the wrong person based on an IP address given they need the ISP’s records, which will link sessions to subscriber, to match a person to that IP?

    • JustAnotherFileServer

      @CarlT Having worked closely with authorities I know that it does not get a warrant to get information from the ISP. In general if a website has an issue it will contact the authorities who will investigate it. In previous cases where a shared IP address has been used then “ALL” those that have used that IP address at the time of the offense will be under investigation.

      This is why having a shared IP address system is a bad idea as it wastes the time and resources of the authorities

    • un4h731x0rp3r0m

      “Okay. How exactly do you propose the authorities prosecute someone without a court order served to the ISP to obtain details on who was using that particular connection at the time?”

      He does not know what he is on about, as per usual and will just spill his nonsense until he has the last say on the matter never mind it being complete and utter crap. He thinks he is an expert on everything but has common sense on nothing.

    • JustAnotherFileServer

      @un4h731x0rp3r0m I see you’ve gone back to your troll name again (getting rather boring now) It show’s how much of a coward you really are that you hide behind different names because you can’t stand by what you say.

      If you knew anything then you would know that once the Police suspect a crime has taken place, it gives them powers to investigate (this includes getting information from the ISP) it also includes seizing a persons property. The Police can get a search warrant (which only takes about 5 mins to get as the Judge rubber stamps the warrant), but most of the time the Police will just use their powers from the fact if they suspect a crime has taken place then that gives them the right to either investigate or failure for a person to comply the person in question can be arrested and questioned.

    • JustAnotherFileServer

      @un4h731x0rp3r0m Another example I could give is that as it’s against the law to create multiple fake accounts on the internet and the Police could investigate yourself. Just thought I would let you know that, just in case you didn’t know about that.

    • CarlT

      Investigatory Powers Act 2016. Would be fine. No need to investigate multiple people.

    • CarlT

      Posting comments on stories here doesn’t require creation of accounts.

      Creating multiple accounts isn’t illegal unless being used to evade bans from accounts: if permission to use an Internet site has been revoked avoiding this is violation of the Computer Misuse Act and probably some other subsequent legislation too.

    • Davy (not my real name or a real pirate OH NO the police are coming) Jones

      “Posting comments on stories here doesn’t require creation of accounts.”

      Lets not let logic get in the way of another outburst from the resident f**king lunatic.

    • JustAnotherFileServer

      You only need to search “laws you break without knowing” to see that it’s a criminal offense to “Use a fake name on the internet”

    • Kermit the frog

      “Justanotherfileserver” with its obviously real name. Oh hang on i may have that wrong, oh well that is you screwed then eh!

      Speaking of laws.Are you still hacking this website to view IP addresses?
      http://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2018/01/cityfibre-vodafone-name-first-uk-city-1gbps-home-broadband.html#comment-185897

      Get some help me lad.

      PS…
      My last post in this thread to you AGAIN…. I can only inhale a certain amount of cretinous poop in a day and being anywhere near you is like being at a broken down water treatment works.

    • JustAnotherFileServer

      @TheTrollWhoChangesTheirNameAlot I don’t use a fake name, if you knew me in real life then you would know how my name on here relates to me in real life. I don’t pretend to be someone else (hint hint, Kermit the frog).

      You still have not got the concept that every time you post online you actually leave a trace of yourself (even if you do use a VPN)

      I know you’re a troll that just likes to go around and around Basingstoke roundabout and I’m sure you think it’s fun, but each to their own I guess.

    • CarlT

      Duly searched.

      You are aware neither we or the systems that this site run on are in the US, and in any event no-one gets prosecuted for violating that particular provision of their horrendously overly vague Computer Fraud and Abuse Act right?

      There are an awful lot of things that are against the law but are never prosecuted.

      In contrast to, say, claiming to have compromised a website to the point where you can see the IP addresses of those accessing it. That one would be in a slightly different class and could certainly land a person in jail.

      You’re an interesting guy for sure. I’ll leave the two of you to carry on in my absence.

    • JustAnotherFileServer

      @CarlT You say that you duly searched, that’s weird because if you had searched then you would have found at the top of the list “The Plymouth Herald”, “The Liverpool Echo”, “Bristol Post”, “The Mirror”, “The Telegraph” and many many others reporting the same thing and your comments about it being the US in fact the law in the UK and the above articles makes that very clear.

      It’s also strange how you refer to other names you post by as other people. Some might class that as split personality or more commonly known as schizophrenia.

    • JustAnotherFileServer

      @CarlT I did ask my company lawyer to see if there had ever been a case where someone had been sent to prison for going onto a website and clicking on the view source button. His response was “He just laughed” he then went on to say that if that was classed as hacking it would have been removed from web browsers long ago.

      I would suggest to you maybe a simple 3 day course about HTML might be beneficial to you as that’s one of the first things they teach you.

    • JustAnotherFileServer

      @CarlT One last point, you might have noticed recently that this site has been updated. You will be pleased to know the site has been fixed and no longer shows the IP address in the HTML source. Just in time for the new GDPR law I would say.

    • un4h731x0rp3r0m

      “@un4h731x0rp3r0m Another example I could give is that as it’s against the law to create multiple fake accounts on the internet and the Police could investigate yourself.”

      I guess all those on Twitch, Youtube and other platforms who not only have many accounts but name them differently sit in terror waiting for cuffs to be slapped on them.

      “Speaking of laws.Are you still hacking this website to view IP addresses?
      http://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.php/2018/01/cityfibre-vodafone-name-first-uk-city-1gbps-home-broadband.html#comment-185897

      Get some help me lad.”

      Oh dear, what a read that was, so hes a super hacker now and hmmm. I guess anyone relatively new to this site should feel highly appreciated that they are held in the same pantheon of what appears to be long term users like CarlT. Im sure he worked years to be be called a troll and accused of being multiple persons.

      “In contrast to, say, claiming to have compromised a website to the point where you can see the IP addresses of those accessing it. That one would be in a slightly different class and could certainly land a person in jail.”

      I think you are going to have to explain to him why hacking rather than using a name equates to something much worse. You might have to go slow and spend the rest of your existence replying to him though.

      “You’re an interesting guy for sure. I’ll leave the two of you to carry on in my absence.”

      I wish i could carry on responding also, but like you i find him far too interesting 😉

      Carl it appears those couple of remarks has triggered him with one after another posting. Im sure he had a long reply ready and waiting just for me also, so i thought it only fair to let him type it…. get to this point of my response let him know nobody cares….. Before he posts it anyway.

    • JustAnotherFileServer

      @un4h731x0rp3r0m I see you’re also been very rude to other people posting on this site to. I guess you’re a long term bully then on this site is what you’re saying. I guess I’ve rattled your cage because you can’t bully me. Maybe one day you might learn there is always a bigger fish.

      The other sites you were also talking about like YT and twitter (maybe you should at their T&Cs. It does state on them that you’re not allow to create fake accounts, even Facebook has a report page where you can report people for using fake names. Also other websites use the tick badge to show a verified account (I guess you will never reach that level 😀 ).

    • CarlT

      Have a minute as I travel.

      Had the source code of this site exposed originating IP addresses you’d have known your claim that I and another poster were the same person was incorrect. Amused you disbelieve the owner of the site, someone who can actually view the originating IP addresses.

      The idea that I routinely post as other people is laughable. We have already been through this. Much as the idea that you are fine calling yourself that while other people are apparently in legal jeopardy is laughable.

      I’ll leave you to your delusions on that note. Toodles 🙂

    • JustAnotherFileServer

      @Carl Thomas You do a lot of leaving 😀

  4. Dean Smith

    Virgin appear to be censoring any mention of this article on the help boards.

    I referenced this, and Benu networks content only to have post pulled.

    For me no public IPv4, no /48 or /56 and no modem mode are instant new ISP time.

    • Dean Smith

      The forums team have helpfully pointed out this article is apparently also ‘confidential’. Naughty ispreivew. 😉

    • un4h731x0rp3r0m

      Yeah really confidential….
      https://community.virginmedia.com/t5/QuickStart-set-up-and/IPv6-support-on-Virgin-media/m-p/3743490/highlight/true#M103815

      Funny they allowed that but not your imaginary posts eh?

    • Dean Smith

      Well, I also linked to pdfs from the vendor site and pointed out why it wouldn’t be a very good solution.

      I suspect that’s the real reason its ‘confidential’

      Can’t have cusutomers, sorry Revenue Genreating Uinits, with opinions now can we.

    • un4h731x0rp3r0m

      “Well, I also linked to pdfs from the vendor site and pointed out why it wouldn’t be a very good solution.

      I suspect that’s the real reason its ‘confidential’”

      Perhaps you should had gained permission from the company first to redistribute their information/pdfs. Thus it appears to be nothing to do with this site posting “confidential” information but more to do with what you attempted to post.

      “Can’t have cusutomers, sorry Revenue Genreating Uinits, with opinions now can we.”

      Customers seem to have have opinions all over their forums about various things and i see now you have joined the thread i pointed to and have been allowed to give your opinion. Again thus nothing to do with opinion and again probably more to do with you attempting to post other organisations information without permission.

      I suggest if you have an issue so much that you have to report on a second site when something you post is removed from another site then perhaps stop using forum type websites.

      The people that own any site are well within their right to remove or not allow content, much in the same way you would not let someone walk into you house with shoes covered in doggy do-do, i imagine you would moderate them first by removing the shoes.

    • Dean Smith

      @un4h731x0rp3r0m I posted links to public webpages and documents, not the PDFs themselves. Argument doesn’t really stack up, or they’d be pulling links to BBC news.

      Or do you think you need permission to post a URL?

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