ISP TalkTalk Loses Over 300,000 UK Broadband and Fibre Customers
Debt-troubled UK broadband ISP TalkTalk recently published their group accounts for the year to 29th February 2024, which reveals that their on-net customer base (fibre FTTP/C and broadband) fell again to 3.6 million (down from 3.94m in 2023). But their Ethernet (leased lines etc.) base grew to 75,000 (up from 69,400).
The accounts cover the period BEFORE the group’s recent move to accept a refinancing package worth roughly £400m (here and here), which saved TalkTalk from the immediate risk of a default. The deal essentially extended the group’s debt maturities to September 2027 and buys them more time to fix the foundations, which won’t be an easy task (here).
The refinancing deal came after the Group had already spent much of the past few years wrestling with their suffocating debts, which in 2023 culminated in a move to demerge the group into three separate businesses (TalkTalk Consumer, TalkTalk Business Direct and the wholesale centric PlatformX Communications – here), while also cutting costs (e.g. marketing) and monetising some assets (e.g. selling IP addresses).
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The hope was that such a demerger would make it easier to sell off individual parts of the business (selling the whole group has proven tricky) and the first piece to go was technically TalkTalk Business Direct, which ended up being sold to the company’s own shareholders for £95m after struggling to attract much interest (here). But so far there have been no further deals, while reports suggest that a proposed deal with Australian banking giant Macquarie for a stake in PlatformX (PXC) fell through.
The latest results, which were published toward the end of October 2024, help to underline the group’s challenges, even if they don’t yet fully reflect the very latest situation. In particular, it is noted that their fibre base declined by c.300k net adds to total 3.01 million (2023: 3.35m) and fibre (FTTC/P) penetration of their customer base now stands at 84% (2023: 85%).
However, the proportion of their overall broadband base on Fibre-to-the-Premises (FTTP) lines has grown to 15% (2023: 9%), while 22% of their FTTP base is now served by alternative networks including CityFibre, CommunityFibre, FreedomFibre and also Virgin Media (O2) – the rest come from Openreach. The ISP also reported having peak network usage of over 10Tbps (Terabits per second).
Summary of the TalkTalk Group’s Key Results to 29th Feb 2024
➤ Churn 1.9% (2023: 1.7%)
➤ Total employees of 1,824 (as at 29th Feb 2024)
➤ Capital expenditure grew to £126m (2023: £118m), mainly due to investing in the roll-out of FTTP and the backhaul network
➤ Ethernet base 75,000 (2023: 69,400)
➤ TalkTalk Business Direct had c.90,000 business customers
➤ On-net ARPU £25.74 (2023: £24.45)
➤ Fibre base declined by c.300k net adds to total 3.01 million (2023: 3.35m)
➤ On-net customer base (fibre and broadband) fell to 3.6 million (2023: 3.94m)
➤ Net debt grew to £986m (2023: £892m), rising to £1.763bn when including leases (2023: £1.604bn)
➤ Total statutory operating profit fell to £7m (2023: £36m)
➤ Headline EBITDA fell to £260m (2023: £297m)
➤ Statutory revenue grew to £1,472m (2023: £1,457m)
Mark is a professional technology writer, IT consultant and computer engineer from Dorset (England), he also founded ISPreview in 1999 and enjoys analysing the latest telecoms and broadband developments. Find me on X (Twitter), Mastodon, Facebook, BlueSky, Threads.net and Linkedin.
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That is going to make turning the business around difficult that about a 10% loss of customers. In a very crowded market winning them back will be tough
When it works it works well. If you have a problem the customer support if not the best. However you pay for what you get.
They seem to have made it difficult if you want phone. If you call you can retain an existing TalkTalk phone number, in newer packages, however it’s not a standard offering for customers moving to TT or existing ones wanting to add to their package.. Given PlusNet have moved to data only, they could pick up their customers if the offered phone packages to new customers too.
A lot of the altnets seem to think people will just want a mobile phone, Perhaps most do but there is still a significant number that still want to keep a landline and not providing that service will cost them customers, Most as well will want to port there number across Ys you can get a phone service from another company but do people really want the hassle of having to deal with two companies
Why stop at phone service? Altnets should bundle electricity and gas into their offering too. After all, do people really want the hassle of having to deal with multiple companies?
I wonder if ISPs reluctant to provide telephony post POTS could just partner with VOIP providers to offer a solution where you just get an ATA and plug it in?
So on the surface it’s e.g. Talktalk but underneath it’s someone else, similar to how the network may be OR.
Finding a decent VOIP provider with inclusive calls to landline and mobile was a bit of a PITA for me since most I came across were either business orientated, PAYG, exclude mobile or in some cases appeared sketchy.
Frankly I might have just paid my ISP Sky for their calls package for convenience, but then I’d have to use their inadequate router.
You pay for what you get? I was with Plusnet for 9 years and the service cost about the same if not less than Talk Talk and yet their customer service was very good.
I know, it is a BT company, and I am giving them praise.
No excuse for bad customer service, sadly a lot of companies try to save money on CS, including the provider I am with, and it suffers as a result.
@Bob, a lot of the larger providers are not bothering with landlines now, ok they have digital voice, well some, but they don’t seem to like people having it as someone I know who tried to change to sky a couple of years ago found out.
The majority of people I know these days use their mobile phones for everything and even if they still have a home, they have either unplugged it or just don’t bother with.
I realise that if you have a bad mobile signal then that can be a problem, but a lot of mobile phone networks these days provide Wi-Fi calling.
Zzoomm do offer a VoIP system, but they don’t really advertise it, which is a shame as it may push them some more customers.
i have my own, but I don’t use it these days.
“Why stop at phone service? Altnets should bundle electricity and gas into their offering too. After all, do people really want the hassle of having to deal with multiple companies?”
You’ve just described Utility Warehouse’s business model (combined with pyramid marketing)
Utility Warehouse aren’t pyramid selling, despite their fairly effective field sales tactics that appear that way. However, energy supply isn’t a simple wholesale to retail activity, it’s wildly complicated behind the scenes with the potential for huge, business-erasing risks if the company mess up. Over the past five or so years, more than 30 energy suppliers went bust because they didn’t understand their own business (and thanks to the last government’s policies we’re all saddled with the costs of that). UW however do have a well run energy supply business – I know because I’ve worked in the energy supply market for some of the largest suppliers for over fifteen years. Although I’ve not worked for Utility Warehouse, I have in the past been a customer of theirs, and found their service pretty good.
Which brings us back to Talktalk – they can’t even manage their own business, if they went into energy supply I reckon they’d be bust within 14 months. Some might then ask “so what have they got to lose?”
Maybe it’s because I’m younger (in my mid 30’s), but I have never had a landline, I remember fighting with BT and the Sky to not have a landline, it was refreshing earlier this year when I switched to one of the Altnets and I didn’t have to fight to have the landline removed from my bill.
My mobile is far more useful and less prone to spam calls. Add to that, that when I am connected to wi-fi my phone uses my broadband to make calls, not my phones minutes. Then add to that, that I cannot not have a mobile, I have to have it. But I don’t need to have a landline, so why pay for both??
Even all my Grandparents/In-Laws have smart phones, with my partners grandmother caving early this year and getting rid of her landline as the only calls that came through on it were sales or scams.
The writing is on the wall for TalkTalk
We had talktalk business accounts (inherited from opal) which were great until talktalk started slipping.
Same with plusnet, until BT merged networks.
Same with easynet and sky. The only conclusion is when you build a network for the customers. It flourishs. If you build a network for shareholders, it sinks.
CityFibre has been giving them money for years in the hope they hit volume commitments. Wrong horse to back it seems.
My talk talk Internet stop working on the 7th October today is the 13th November and it’s still not working.In that time I’ve had 4 new router sent had 5 open reach engineer visits one talk talk engineer visit one open reach visit no one turned up one talk talk engineer visit cancelled on the morning of visit and had it rescheduled for tomorrow 14th. Had spent over 8 hours on chats with them had over 20 texts and about 13 phone conversation and still no Internet service..
Talk Talk customer service needs a complete overall, it’s none responsive, has no compassion,It’s no wonder people have voted with their feet, I have also spent days on chat for a terminal I’ll neighbour trying to resolve a fault when they tested the line it was faulty, they would not report it to open reach until they had the account holders permission, he was unresponsive and his very elderly wife needed the emergency phone line for doctors. He died three days after, the phone line is in limbo, shame on you TalkTalk
The need for a basic landlines is essential for those over 60 years and not in perfect health. If the government want to modernise the system, a box to receive the Internet no problem but to throw out the old landline system including copper wire
madness……..
With so many operators entering the market it would be surprising if the established players aren’t losing customers. Unfortunately there’s only so many customers to go round.
True, but that is the same for any business, but sometimes I do wonder how some keep going, like in the city I live, Barber shops and restaurants and coffee shops galore. Still only a small city, sure it has grown a bit over the years., but still wonder where they get all the customers.
People will go for price and quality, but a lot, price first, certainly at the moment with prices increasing all the time.
I have heard from a few people that the amount of use they get from broadband they don’t want to pay a load and that is where ISPs like Talk Talk, plusnet and even Now came in, but even that was too much for some people.
This describes me. I don’t need a land line BUT wife wants one despite 4 mobile phone contracts!.
Talktalk advertised fttp for £35 (500) and adds £2 for landline. I initially chose Vodaphone for £30 and comes with free landlines but then you have to pay £10 for unlimited calls.
Having spent 1hr 20 mins for talk talk to say they can offer me the £35 deal for £58..! And then went down to £35.
Whenni called back they said lowest with call package is £37.
Now when I look on line neither vodafone OR Talktalk offer a phone package, so not sure what i was being sold!.
Still on my £28 package. Which is 42mbs and unlimited calls.
I used to be, I need to keep a landline., at the time mainly for my Father to phone me, so when I changed from ADSL to a wireless network years ago I got myself a VoIP system, and then when I changed to FTTC, I kept it as people knew the number, so not worth telling people my new home number.
since then my father have died and the only other person that use to ring me on the home phone is my brother, but I now got him to phone my mobile.
so these days my VoIP phone stands silent as it is not used. No doubt wasting electric to run the DECT phones and the VoiP hub. Ok, not a lot of electric.
These days I have changed my mind about keeping the home phone, If I had to give it up now, I would not care. The reason i keep it is because I still have money on it for calls.
I think in time there will be even less provider selling a home phone package, they want you to use their mobile services if they have one, which a lot of the larger ISPs do these days.
I did have one with plusnet when they offered one, but I moved to Smarty as they have a better deal for me.
Customer service at Talk Talk is beyond poor – I’ve been trying to add a TV hub to my broadband since 25th September – three letters of complaint, the last to Susie Buckridge and NO replies. The last phone call from them (from a real person in Manchester) promised it would be sent out by last Friday (8th November) but still nothing.
My next port of call has to be OFFCOM
Well my recent experience have added 1 to their next reporting period, and to think years ago I reccomeneded them (TTB) to colleagues and aquaintencies, shame on me :-(.
Paying for you you get is no excuse for not-fit-for-purpose (in processes, support, and or customer ‘service’). The way they’re currently ‘working’ would have had me sacked in my service delivery / account management / Project days.